To the exceptionally stupid woman......

[adonirum]

Like a few threads that have gone before, I shall vent my spleen here.

To the woman that decided to run, yes run, out into/onto the zebra crossing, whilst pushing a buggy, at the bottom of Barry Road/Forest Hill Road and into Peckham Park,at about 11.15 this morning. I would like to let you know how lucky, yes that's LUCKY, you were, nay your child was, that it was myself you encountered. I was the driver of the black Jag that you looked at in such a disdainful manner when I pulled up quickly and sharply. You are very lucky that I abide by the speed limit of 20mph and that training in my past has taught me to take in the wider aspect of a street scene when driving. I anticipated you doing what you did. Another driver may not have been able to do so, and certainly the buggy would have been hit if the old limit of 30mph was in force. As for a vehicle speeding,at say 40 mph,then the consequences don't bear thinking about. You really should have got out of this habit by the time you were about six or seven years old.

Be considerate towards drivers, in general, but YOUR CHILD,in particular, in the future.(Hope it was your child and not another parent's!!). Nothing can possibly be so important as to take such a risk to save a few seconds.

[Gloves]

Black Jag eh! Someone is doing alright!

[Mick Mac]

I am always wary of pedestrians who are approaching zebra crossings. Drivers should always slow down on approaching them even if there is no one around. As a pedestrian I often am about to step out but can see that the car won't stop.

Running onto a zebra crossing when a car is approaching and not clearly able to stop is very risky. But likewise the car should always be able to stop?

[Louisa]

A car doesn't officially have to stop at a zebra crossing, unless someone is already walking across it. However, it is common courtesy in my book for a driver to stop if they see someone waiting. The warning I would offer pedestrians, being one myself as well as a driver, is that you should never assume a driver has enough time to break if you suddenly approach and mount the crossing at speed. You're putting yourself at considerable risk, especially around here where stupid crazy drivers assume they can approach crossings at 40mph with music blaring and be able to stop in time.

Louisa.

[Abe_froeman]

You are obliged under the highway code to approach a zebra crossing with caution and be ready to stop or slow down and let pedestrians cross.

If there had been an accident on the crossing in the circumstances described in the OP, the driver of the car would have been at fault.

[Gloves]

In theory the pedestrian should approach, stop, and then thank the driver when they stop.....then cross.

On Lordship Lane there is no excuse to go over 20 MPH.

As a cyclist, driver and pedestrian it seems that adonirum was going too fast. Scummish really.

[Abe_froeman]

Thanking the driver is very polite but might encourage some drivers to think they have the right not stop. They don't, they must give way to pedestrians.

[Mick Mac]

Louisa Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> A car doesn't officially have to stop at a zebra

> crossing, unless someone is already walking across

> it.

How does that work in practice, no car has to stop until you're on it, so you step out and hope the car stops?

[Mick Mac]

Mick Mac Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Louisa Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > A car doesn't officially have to stop at a

> zebra

> > crossing, unless someone is already walking

> across

> > it.

>

> How does that work in practice, no car has to stop

> until you're on it, so you step out and hope the

> car stops?

Your right - I never thank drivers :) especially if I think they weren't showing any signs of slowing down until I actually stepped out.

[Louisa]

Well it's common sense really, as a pedestrian you wait and if the car stops you walk out onto the crossing. I personally always thank drivers, purely because it's courteous, something distinctly lacking in this city of arrogance.

If you are already using the crossing the driver must obviously stop. The whole point of the zebra crossing is to promote friendly cohesion between drivers, pedestrians and cyclists alike.

Louisa.

[Mick Mac]

Louisa Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Well it's common sense really, as a pedestrian you

> wait and if the car stops you walk out onto the

> crossing.

I'd say that's not really how it's supposed to work. Pedestrians have right of way, therefore the car should always be ready to stop, you don't have to wait for it to stop, apart from the fact that due to some inconsiderate motorists it's some times wise to do so.

[Jeremy]

Yeah of course if there was an accident on a zebra crossing, I'd expect the law would fall on the side of the pedestrian every time. But that's not really the point. There are bad drivers out there, so be careful, and look after yourself and your kids.

[KidKruger]

I think that it's bad form for pedestrians who walk alongside a zebra crossing and then suddenly start crossing without even a pause or indication that they are intending to use the crossing. I see this quite a lot.

It is just unsafe and inviting trouble.

Having right of way doesn't remove basic courtesy (and the safety that is commensurate with it), pedestrians showing no intention of crossing means drivers may slow down to be cautious but obviously won't stop.

Even at 20mph or less, accidents can happen in this way - including the driver correctly stopping but car behind not realising the pedestrian was intending to cross and ging into back of lead car (seen this).

[rendelharris]

KidKruger Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Even at 20mph or less, accidents can happen in

> this way - including the driver correctly stopping

> but car behind not realising the pedestrian was

> intending to cross and ging into back of lead car

> (seen this).

If they can't stop then they're driving badly - only a fool breaks the two second rule etc.

[KidKruger]

No argument about that but once the pedestrian has a broken femur, pointing fingers of blame doesn't really help.

Is my point.

This can be avoided in many cases by pedestrians not suddenly jumping onto the crossing 'just because they can'.

I'm sure most drivers are always ready to stop but some make assumptions based on what they think is (not) going to happen.

[Jeremy]

But why force a driver to slam on the brakes with almost no notice? Yes the driver should be able to stop in time, but why would you risk your own safety like that?

Makes absolutely no sense at all, and I'm amazed some people apparently believe there's a case to be argued.

[by the way, the two second rule concerns driving behind another vehicle, and is not applicable to pedestrian crossings]

[rendelharris]

Jeremy Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> But why force a driver to slam on the brakes with

> almost no notice? Yes the driver should be able to

> stop in time, but why would you risk your own

> safety like that?

>

> Makes absolutely no sense at all, and I'm amazed

> some people apparently believe there's a case to

> be argued.

>

>

I think we're at cross purposes Jeremy (and I agree that it's foolish to step out assuming a driver will stop): KK was talking about a second car running into the back of the car which has stopped for the pedestrian - that was what I was referring to when I mentioned the two second rule, that the second car shouldn't be following so close that this scenario would arise.

[Dog duck]

Jeremy Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> But why force a driver to slam on the brakes with

> almost no notice? Yes the driver should be able to

> stop in time, but why would you risk your own

> safety like that?

>

> Makes absolutely no sense at all, and I'm amazed

> some people apparently believe there's a case to

> be argued.

>

>

Well said. Let's leave it at that. It's a nice day.

[Jeremy]

Oh right I see what you were getting at.

Yeah I think it's fair to say that if a driver can't execute an emergency stop in time to avoid shunting another vehicle on a 20mph road (or even a 30mph road) then he's driving badly. But there are plenty of bad drivers out there...

[stringvest]

Yes, there are many exceptionally stupid women around, like the ones who decant shopping and kids in the middle of the road instead of on the pavement, I nearly got one the other day!!! It would have been MY FAULT wouldn't it?

[Nigello]

Stupidity abounds, mainly because people really don't think it can happen to them. A man had his baby in front-sling, standing over the yellow line on the Central line earlier today, saying "choo-choo, here it comes". I looked at him old-fashionedly, but he was caught up dandling his child just feet from an electrified line as a train was about to arrive. Other parents insist on getting off the bus, straining their necks and then rushing over the (busy) road when the crossing is just 20" walk away.

[Seabag]

I've had something not dissimilar happen. Pedestrian at full tilt walking tight to the kerb, who then at full march, head down (without looking) does a 45 degree quick turn onto the crossing.

I'm a driver and a pedestrian, but to 'set-up' a driver with such an obviously dangerous manoeuvre is deliberately trying to challenge the mutual respect of the rules of the road, along with risking life and limb. I wonder if some people get off on the 'pedestrian right of way' power trip thing.

Ergo bikes, cars, running, buggies...etc.

[Earl Aelfheah]

I love the completely unnecessary 'black jag' detail. Someone is very proud 😂

Like others have said, you should be ready to stop at a zebra crossing and looking out for pedestrians about to cross.

[Alan Medic]

Would an exceptionally stupid woman know what a black jag looked like or even a black cortina?

[Earl Aelfheah]

Would anyone care?