The Gowlett - noise abatement

[mancity68]

Spotted on another forum, thought forumites might have views https://www.urban75.net/forums/threads/the-gowlett-needs-your-help.351768/

[micromacromonkey]

We have lived opposite the Gowlett for 7 years and are appalled by this nonsense. Sure, it's a bit noisy occasionally, but that's because it's a pub. In fact since they added the little vestibule thing on the side door it's never really bothered us at all. Most recent residents only moved here because of the atmosphere generated by places like the Gowlett, that is what makes this area what it is and not some shit suburban wasteland.

Check their twitter and facebook, I believe Johnny is preparing some sort of response and some info on how to fight this order, it will need plenty of local support.

Dan

[dirac]

Ahh man really? What is it with the authorities listening to whinging neighbors? It's an effing pub, of course it's going to be loud on occasions.

[????]

People who move near a pub and then moan about the noise make me puke - i love pubs but personally I wouldn't move near one - if you do then that's your choice

[dirac]

???? Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> People who move near a pub and then moan about the

> noise make me puke - i love pubs but personally I

> wouldn't move near one - if you do then that's

> your choice

Exactly this. I couldn't hack it but as micromacromonkey said above it's pubs like this that stops the area just becoming a suburban wasteland with no character. From being in bands over the years I've witnessed so many decent pubs with gig venues close down making it harder and harder for bands to play places. Most of the time it's because of something like this.

[KidKruger]

Self-entitled bullshit to move next to a popular pub then expect the operation to change just for them.

By that twisted logic every city pub in the land is in danger !

How can this even be a consideration for the Council ?!

[girlelectric]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C9t4tlGW0AEKhL9.jpg

[mancity68]

Completely agree. I did once go to look at the flat next door to the Gowlett. Great flat but I knew I wouldn't have been able to hack living next to the pub so decided against it.

[Louisa]

Pubs are places which are often noisy, get the fuck over it! Used to be a Gowlett occasional visitor back in the 80's and it was a lot noisier then and I can't remember anyone ever moaning about it. Yet another example of poncy people buying near a boozer and expecting the whole world to change for them. Should be supporting surviving pubs, not going out your way to close them down.

Louisa.

[NewWave]

Louisa Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Pubs are places which are often noisy, get the

> @#$%& over it! Used to be a Gowlett occasional

> visitor back in the 80's and it was a lot noisier

> then and I can't remember anyone ever moaning

> about it. Yet another example of poncy people

> buying near a boozer and expecting the whole world

> to change for them. Should be supporting surviving

> pubs, not going out your way to close them down.

>

> Louisa.

couldn't agree more it really annoys me when people move to an area because of its 'vibrant'pub and bar culture then whinge about the noise.

Also people who buy next to or near a Pub then bleat about how noisy it is then complain.

Its like buying a place on a main road and complaining about traffic noise.

Some people need to get a life..or move to the country.

Mind you then they'd probably complain about the noise from church bells and tractors.

[Pugwash]

We live 3 doors down from a pub with a garden - it can get noisy on good days with the kids yelling, but generally no bother. Occasional live bands especially at weekends.

[JohnL]

???? Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> People who move near a pub and then moan about the

> noise make me puke - i love pubs but personally I

> wouldn't move near one - if you do then that's

> your choice

But if people get noisy (in Rye Lane - whistler for

instance) I get up and shout at them (so adding to

the noise ironically :) )

The new blocks of flats will be rented out - so

landlords/estate agents will be money oriented -

so complaints will be made just to maximise profits.

[JohnL]

NewWave Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Louisa Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Pubs are places which are often noisy, get the

> > @#$%& over it! Used to be a Gowlett occasional

> > visitor back in the 80's and it was a lot

> noisier

> > then and I can't remember anyone ever moaning

> > about it. Yet another example of poncy people

> > buying near a boozer and expecting the whole

> world

> > to change for them. Should be supporting

> surviving

> > pubs, not going out your way to close them

> down.

> >

> > Louisa.

>

>

> couldn't agree more it really annoys me when

> people move to an area because of its 'vibrant'pub

> and bar culture then whinge about the noise.

> Also people who buy next to or near a Pub then

> bleat about how noisy it is then complain.

> Its like buying a place on a main road and

> complaining about traffic noise.

> Some people need to get a life..or move to the

> country.

> Mind you then they'd probably complain about the

> noise from church bells and tractors.

What noise (24/7/365) does is gradually make you

"on edge" and ready to explode - it's very gradual

but it does change you.

It's the beeps of traffic - who think somebody

didn't just beep 30 seconds before, or the screams

of girls falling over at 4 AM.

[JohnL]

and I don't expect people to change and never

complain but when I go off on one - accept that

too

If pubs liked their neighbours - really liked us

they'd give us cheaper beer :) hint hint

[Help-Ma-Boab]

I love the Gowlett. I do have a sense there maybe more to this than meets the eye. More than a precious neighbour wanting countryside levels of quiet at 7.30.

Just have a feeling about it.

[Willard]

Such as....

Help-Ma-Boab Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I love the Gowlett. I do have a sense there maybe

> more to this than meets the eye. More than a

> precious neighbour wanting countryside levels of

> quiet at 7.30.

>

> Just have a feeling about it.

[Jeremy]

Similar thing happened to Hoopers, I believe. Let's hope The Gowlett doesn't go the same way, it's a cracking little local.

I wonder if anything can be done on a practical level to lend support to their appeal - i.e. rather than just tweeting "I support you"? Surely several supportive local residents should outweigh one complaint?

[Help-Ma-Boab]

Nothing concrete. Just the tone of the FB profile that as posted by Gowlett, when Johnny unearthed who he thought the complainant was. It was quickly taken down but was screenshotted on The Gowlett FB page. Still there. Then some of the comments on Urban thread above.

There is a suggestion that this has gone on for a while, that's all.

As I said I love the Gowlett.

ETA:

*I see now that some posts on the Urban75 thread have been deleted - mysterious*

Willard Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Such as....

>

>

> Help-Ma-Boab Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > I love the Gowlett. I do have a sense there

> maybe

> > more to this than meets the eye. More than a

> > precious neighbour wanting countryside levels

> of

> > quiet at 7.30.

> >

> > Just have a feeling about it.

[Jeremy]

Yeah it does sound like there might perhaps be some sort of "beef". Not that it's going to make much difference to the outcome.

[Help-Ma-Boab]

From the urban75 thread. I can kind of sympathise if this is the core issue that's going on. Not if the complaint was at 7pm...I suspect not:

"The one caveat with that is that some residents will have lived in Gowlett Road since the days when pubs called time at 11pm, whereas I believe the Gowlett now stays open an hour later than that on weekdays and two hours later on Fridays & Saturdays. Throw in a few pissed people congregating outside after the final bell and that's potentially a much greater nuisance than if everyone has gone and the doors are locked by 11.30"

Pretty much this is the core of the issue

There are locals who have been patrons of the G for years but the interloper hipster filth that swarm around the gaff in the early hours seem to be the cause of the late night noise - you just have to look at the Rye lane over a weekend to see the impact of these hirsute locusts. A balance needs to be struck and struck quickly - ratcheting up the animosity between resident and business will only result in one outcome now this has been flagged.

As to moving next to a pub and bleating, the situation with the G and complaints is not wholly due to newly arrived Clapham diaspora flexing their complain muscles. I would not want to live next to the G these days.

[Louisa]

HMB if out of town Hipsters are the problem then I'd have some sympathy, because tbh they tend to go to all sorts of places make a mess and loud noise then bugger off back to their houseshare in a posh part of town. I suspect, that isn't the case here though, although maybe I'm wrong and that's played some part in the matter. Who knows? If it's just a new resident flexing their righteous muscles after buying next to a existing boozer then my sympathy levels are at zero for said individual.

Louisa.

[Help-Ma-Boab]

I agree with you Louisa. I love the Gowlett.

Im only just raising that it may not be the NIMBY 7pm complainer that's all. I, like you, don't know. It does appear that on the Urban75 thread -https://www.urban75.net/forums/threads/the-gowlett-needs-your-help.351768/ the posters are closer to it and give more info on possible causes of the conflict.

I live miles away - by a busy road. Id love to live next to The Gowlett.

Louisa Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> HMB if out of town Hipsters are the problem then

> I'd have some sympathy, because tbh they tend to

> go to all sorts of places make a mess and loud

> noise then bugger off back to their houseshare in

> a posh part of town. I suspect, that isn't the

> case here though, although maybe I'm wrong and

> that's played some part in the matter. Who knows?

> If it's just a new resident flexing their

> righteous muscles after buying next to a existing

> boozer then my sympathy levels are at zero for

> said individual.

>

> Louisa.

[Penguin68]

If it is true that the noise profile of the pub has changed significantly since someone moved close to it (and assuming that complaints only started when it was clear that this change was permanent) then the complainer has some more right on their side than has previously been assumed by many posters. If.

But, and in general, if you are close to useful facilities (be that pubs or late night shops or whatever) - then you trade disturbance for convenience. To choose to live somewhere and then try to change it to more closely match your real needs (having perhaps obtained your property at prices which reflect the current realities) is less than admirable (as those who have tried to make 'their' streets private to them, or to exclude others from using them e.g.to park may wish to note).

[micromacromonkey]

Somewhat ironically I'd say that it's got better rather than worse over the last couple of years, since they put the extra door/vestibule thing on the side. I wonder if there is more that can be done with soundproofing (e.g. double glazing?) as proving that all 'best practical means' have been tried to mitigate noise is the principal defence to the noise abatement charge. http://www.environmentlaw.org.uk/rte.asp?id=76

I understand the concern somewhat about the late licence but it seems typically to only be once per week (one of thu/fri/sat). I understand that other people may have a different view on what constitutes acceptable noise levels, but we do live literally opposite and have felt the need to go across the road and moan to Johnny about the noise say 5 times in 7 years, on each occasion he turned it down or got the braying claphamites outside to STFU or whatever it was.

I think our opinion (being located so close) is worth as much if not more than the original complainant, so hopefully that will be taken into account.

Of course there may be some backstory to all this, but if someone has a personal grudge against the place/landlord then they need to sort that out in a different way rather than vindictively serving abatement notices.

[ianr]

It's council officers who make the decision about any alleged statutory nuisance: https://www.gov.uk/guidance/noise-nuisances-how-councils-deal-with-complaints.

Could someone please post notice here of when and where the appeal hearing will be. I assume it'll be Camberwell Green.