8 June

[uncleglen]

tomdhu Wrote:

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> Lordship 516 Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > uncleglen Wrote:

> >

> --------------------------------------------------

>

> >

> > The Britain I know & am very comfortable with

> does

> > not exist in NI.

>

> Don't get too comfortable because the SNP have

> stoked up huge amount of animosity amongst the

> Scots working class (or non-working class))

> against England in the last few years for their

> own political gain. Very sad really in my view as

> someone with Scottish interests.

what is this- I didn't write that first bit...I've worked with many from Northern Ireland both catholic and protestant and they were all very 'British'...although I could never understand their relaxed attitude to consuming large amounts of alcohol, even though my granny was Irish

[Earl Aelfheah]

They're still parroting sound bites. It's pathetic.

[red devil]

FFS he actually used 'will of the people', I would've thought after the GE even the most hard-bitten Brexiteer had consigned that one to the dustbin...

[rendelharris]

Loz Wrote:

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> Lordship 516 Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

>

> > She has apologized many many times to the

> > conservatives but she has yet to apologize to

> the

> > electorate for her shambles...

>

> You want her to apologise to the electorate for

> them not voting for her enough to give her a

> majority? She got more votes than Corbyn - does

> he have to apologise as well?

>

> You have a really weird viewpoint of the world.

I assume Lordship means, and I agree, that she should apologise for calling an entirely unnecessary general election (what do these things cost, by the way? I bet it's some quite horrendous sum) which has left the political system and the Brexit process in chaos, simply because she wanted a) to boost her own ego by becoming an elected rather than unelected prime minister and b) to grab power for another five years instead of the three she had left and guard against losing in 2020 should Brexit go wrong. Well deserving of an apology I'd say.

ETA The election will have cost around ?150M, including, extraordinarily, ?9M given to MPs who've lost their seats as "winding up expenses." Certainly winds me up!

[Jenny1]

rendelharris Wrote:

> Well deserving of an apology I'd say.

>

> ETA The election will have cost around ?150M,

> including, extraordinarily, ?9M given to MPs

> who've lost their seats as "winding up expenses."

> Certainly winds me up!

Absolutely. Appalling waste of money. And of course the election was called with the aim of promoting TM's stance on Brexit which is specifically designed to kipper the economy and consequently put the funding of public services at risk.

I still don't get when the Tories became the party of messing up the finances. The only selling point they've had in my lifetime was the argument that they promoted business and industry, thus creating wealth that would benefit all. I can't say I'm convinced by the 'trickle down' argument - but it was all they had, and now they've ditched it.

[Alan Medic]

red devil Wrote:

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> Can anyone remember what the final EDF election

> poll figures were? From memory around 61% of

> EDFers were intending to vote Labour, but in the

> GE is was over 69%. Just wondering how

> representative the EDF is of the area...

> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/politics/constituencies/

> E14000673

I think it was more like 64% with Conservative 21%.

[red devil]

Quite representative then, just slightly more support for the Tories on the EDF...who'da funked it! :)

[Lordship 516]

Loz Wrote:

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> Lordship 516 Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

>

> > She has apologized many many times to the

> > conservatives but she has yet to apologize to

> the

> > electorate for her shambles...

>

> You want her to apologise to the electorate for

> them not voting for her enough to give her a

> majority? She got more votes than Corbyn - does

> he have to apologise as well?

>

> You have a really weird viewpoint of the world.

My point is very simple:

'May is still only working for the Conservative party interests'

In all her communications she appears only to care about the damage to the conservative party & her own ego & cares little about the damage she has wrought on the country.

She has expressed great sympathy for MPs losing their seats & income and says she will help them but she has no compunction in taking badly needed income from the poor, the sick, the disabled & the old. At the same time she distributes tax relief largesse to her crony supporters & sits on her hands and does very little to collect a reasonable amount of tax from Starbucks, Facebook,Microsoft, Google, Amazon etc. The argument that they would take flight is not valid - they would stay because they have a lucrative market here even if they paid more tax.

Let the newly unemployed MP take a hike down to the nearest Job Centre Plus & ask for their entitlements just like every other citizen & offer to retrain for a viable job - the expert staff will give them good advice & enrol them in great training programs that will enable them to get a good job - there are lots of jobs available or so she says; if they have a cashflow problem in waiting for their Universal Credit to kick in they then let them go to the food bank; if they don't know where it is, just ask a nurse who is short of cash or a policeman who has been sacked - they will let them know how the system works.

This person is an ogre of the highest Thatcherite order.

As usual, you are quoting selectively out of context - that is your way of projecting your contorted view to the world, which of course, is your right..

[Mark]

Here you go:

Independent - Yen Lin Chong 1%

Labour - Helen Hayes 62%

Liberal Democrat - Gail Kent 11%

Independent - Robin Lambert 0%

Green Party - Rashid Nix 3%

Conservative - Rachel Wolf 20%

None of the above 3%

http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?5,1828514,1828514#msg-1828514

[Lordship 516]

uncleglen Wrote:

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> ... even though my granny was Irish

UG - There's hope for you yet..!

[steveo]

'TM's stance on Brexit which is specifically designed to kipper the economy...'

Could you explain to us why she wants to destroy the economy? Is she a KGB agent?

[DaveR]

"This person is an ogre of the highest Thatcherite order."

So TM should apologise to you for having the temerity to hold different political beliefs?

Not very persuasive.

[steveo]

516 = ampersand

[Lordship 516]

DaveR Wrote:

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> "This person is an ogre of the highest Thatcherite

> order."

>

> So TM should apologise to you for having the

> temerity to hold different political beliefs?

>

> Not very persuasive.

It is a statement - not an argument.

She can hold any view she wishes, but now it is the whole country that is suffering from her views.

[Lordship 516]

May started stuffing envelopes for the party aged 12...now she's stuffing the rest of us, for the party...

[Jules-and-Boo]

do you really think she was promoting the party? or her own interests?

[Jah Lush]

Interviewed and written just before the election everyone should read this especially the Tory voters among you.

http://spectre-online.org/steve-keen-anti-economist-supports-corbyn-brexit/

[Jenny1]

steveo Wrote:

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> 'TM's stance on Brexit which is specifically

> designed to kipper the economy...'

>

> Could you explain to us why she wants to destroy

> the economy? Is she a KGB agent?

What fun it would be if she were! No - more prosaic than that. Simply not strong or principled enough to keep the economic interests of the country as her first priority whilst mounting a rearguard action against the right wing of her own party. John Major managed it - and he's not exactly Winston Churchill - so there's really no excuse that neither she or Cameron could.

The 'specifically designed' is facetious on my part, of course. But it's supposed to highlight the fact that the policy was in no way 'designed' to achieve anything, except keep the UKIP wing of the Tories happy.

[Jenny1]

....and actually if you had wanted to design a policy to kipper the economy, ironically, hers would have been a fine one.

[DaveR]

"It is a statement - not an argument."

That's an interesting distinction. So if I said "Lordship 516 demonstrates a shaky grasp on political and economic reality, and his/her prose style also leaves a lot to be desired", a view with which you would presumably disagree, an appropriate response from me would be "It's a statement, not an argument"?

[Lordship 516]

DaveR Wrote:

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> "It is a statement - not an argument."

>

> That's an interesting distinction. So if I said

> "Lordship 516 demonstrates a shaky grasp on

> political and economic reality, and his/her prose

> style also leaves a lot to be desired", a view

> with which you would presumably disagree, an

> appropriate response from me would be "It's a

> statement, not an argument"?

Your opinion is always valid for you.

Let's see where the political & economic realities land in the months to come.

[DaveR]

"Your opinion is always valid for you."

But I recognise that that is exactly what it is - an opinion. And I'm willing to discuss it, and who knows, I might even be persuaded that it should change.

Millions of people just voted for the Tories, and they are the largest party in the Commons. But to you, those people are 'wrong', because TM (like Thatcher before her) is an 'ogre'. Which is a statement. So there. It's not just valid, it's right. And by the way, Irish people can't be British.

As I said, not very persuasive. And not very impressive.

[Jah Lush]

"The counting house is counting up it's money." Chaos ahead.

http://www.dw.com/en/london-may-lose-euro-clearing-business/a-39227376

[Sue]

Loz Wrote:

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> red devil Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Corbs on the other hand is a lifelong campaigner

> and was

> > totally in his element.

>

> *After* he relented and did some media training.

>

>

> The man is a walking advertisement for some

> consultancy somewhere - they did a remarkable job.

I don't think that's true.

I heard him speak just after (literally just after) he had been put under pressure all afternoon by Labour MPs who wanted him to stand down as leader.

He was totally inspiring.

That was months and months ago.

The only reason anybody would think otherwise was because of biased media coverage.

I doubt very much any consultancy has been involved. He didn't need it.

[Lordship 516]

DaveR Wrote:

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> "Your opinion is always valid for you."

>

> But I recognise that that is exactly what it is -

> an opinion. And I'm willing to discuss it, and

> who knows, I might even be persuaded that it

> should change.

>

> Millions of people just voted for the Tories, and

> they are the largest party in the Commons. But to

> you, those people are 'wrong', because TM (like

> Thatcher before her) is an 'ogre'. Which is a

> statement. So there. It's not just valid, it's

> right. And by the way, Irish people can't be

> British.

>

> As I said, not very persuasive. And not very

> impressive.

You jump to too many conclusions. To me Tory voters are not 'wrong' per se - I never made any statement that the Tory voters were wrong; it is their democratic right to cast their vote as they wish - I do regard that in my opinion they are misguided. It is my opinion that May & Thatcher are/were selfish unfeeling ogres obsessed with their own persona and power. You are conflating your own thoughts.

I'm Irish by birth, my father was Irish by choice but reluctantly British as he was born before Ireland as a nation in its own right came into being. I have a British Passport that describes me as a 'subject' & live in England that is part of Great Britain which in turn is part of the United Kingdom.

When I'm watching a rugby or other sports match I am Irish, when I pay my taxes I am British - so what am I? I am a person in my own right like everyone is.

BTW, I care less if you are impressed or not.