Boycott Picturehouse?

[Jules-and-Boo]

thanks RH.I was trying to think of how to say the same thing!

[Louisa]

I don't wish to get too involved here, but I do struggle with the double standards of some people who move to places like East Dulwich (I'm not singling anyone here btw).

Lots of people on this forum begged, nay pleaded, for this cinema to come here and open up (as they did M&S). I remember at the time saying that it would force more families on a low income out of the area for things to do because of high prices and yet everyone jumped at me and accused me of stirring up class hatred, that was never the intention. We have a lovely independent cinema on our doorsteps just a brisk walk away and so many people are rude and critical about it on here. Do you realise how lucky you are to have such a cheap and well run resource on your doorsteps in Peckham? But no, you choose to use a chain in ED. Then when the moment suits, the ethical hat is worn and everyone's up in arms about the LLW and how awful picturehouse is. Why did you spend months begging them to come here if you knew about what was happening at Brixton Ritzy? Why do you still go there on the quiet but then come on here telling them off about how awful they are for the way they treat workers? Now THAT is hypocritical.

Louisa.

[rendelharris]

Louisa, as far as I'm aware, nobody on this thread or elsewhere has said "I disagree with what Picturehouse are doing but I'm still going there." So where do you get you information that people are doing this? Just like Geobz, you're simply making assumptions which suit your argument. If anyone on here who's criticising Cineworld/Picturehouse is still patronising them then yes they're a hypocrite, but where are these people?

[Louisa]

There are people on this thread rendal, who openly talk about patronising this establishment, and yet on other threads like to wear the 'ethical hat'. I'm not making it up to suit my argument, it's true. I just find it painful to listen to certain people praising this cinema on the one hand, then talking about how they care about workers rights on other threads. You can't be a socialist when it suits, if you care about social justice then it should be in every thread of your being, not just when the moment is right.

Louisa.

[BrandNewGuy]

Though as my cynical old English teacher used to say, "Better be a hypocrite than wrong all the time..."

[Mick Mac]

titch juicy Wrote:

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>

> But is it's peer. It's the only other local

> business providing the same service. The only

> things that differentiate are the price, the cafe

> and the fact that Peckham Plex has a much larger

> choice of films.

I don't think in the financial world it would be seen as a comparable at all. ED PH's comparables are the higher end cinemas, and in that respect I think its charges are fair.

Peckham is an outlier in charging only ?5. Possibly one of the cheapest in London. Its not something ED PH will be comparing itself to when looking at product and price.

[Cassius]

Peckham Plex is great if you want to see a mainsteam film but it doesn't offer 'Event' cinema - such as screenings of the NT, ROH etc. I go to whichever is showing the film I want to see at a time that is convenient for me.

[JoeLeg]

Louisa Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> There are people on this thread rendal, who openly

> talk about patronising this establishment, and yet

> on other threads like to wear the 'ethical hat'.

> I'm not making it up to suit my argument, it's

> true. I just find it painful to listen to certain

> people praising this cinema on the one hand, then

> talking about how they care about workers rights

> on other threads. You can't be a socialist when it

> suits, if you care about social justice then it

> should be in every thread of your being, not just

> when the moment is right.

>

> Louisa.

I'm confused (not unusual for me)...

Do you support things like LLW? Are you saying that you aren't a hypocrite for visiting Plex, MacDonalds and Harvester? Because for sure they don't pay it.

I don't mind if you don't, it's your money and your conscience. I'm (honestly) just trying to work out where you stand on this issue.

[Earl Aelfheah]

For me as a consumer to take my business elsewhere, you have to make a relative judgement. People say 'go to Peckhamplex and boycott Picturehouse'. But if Picturehouse pay their staff a higher wage than Peckhamplex (which I'm pretty sure they do, in fact Picturehouse appear to pay more than most cinemas) - then clearly the boycott is unhelpful / misdirected.

It doesn't mean that you don't support workers rights, or even the Picturehouse employees campaign for higher wages.

[Earl Aelfheah]

BTW - I don't get the Peckhamplex v's Picturehouse narrative here. It's not a zero sum game. You can like and visit both.

[titch juicy]

rahrahrah Wrote:

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> BTW - I don't get the Peckhamplex v's Picturehouse

> narrative here. It's not a zero sum game. You can

> like and visit both.

True. If I started that whole thing I apologise.

[El Presidente]

How is going to Peckhamplex because they are cheaper an ethical thing to do? There is no way they pay their staff LLW on ?5 a ticket! No, going there is actually embracing capitalism at it's finest. You are embracing a company which uses cheaper labour to provide a cheaper service. Which is fine. Competition is good and will keep the prices at Picturehouse in check.

But it's not 'ethical'. Quite the opposite.

[titch juicy]

El Presidente Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> How is going to Peckhamplex because they are

> cheaper an ethical thing to do? There is no way

> they pay their staff LLW on ?5 a ticket! No, going

> there is actually embracing capitalism at it's

> finest. You are embracing a company which uses

> cheaper labour to provide a cheaper service. Which

> is fine. Competition is good and will keep the

> prices at Picturehouse in check.

>

> But it's not 'ethical'. Quite the opposite.

Did anyone claim it was more ethical?

[Mick Mac]

Well, let's just agree that the OP is supposedly an ethical stance and people on the same thread are suggesting going to Peckham Plex, so obviously people feel the need to points out the uselessness of that as an alternative venue in the event that you follow the OPs advice to boycott ED PH.

[Louisa]

JoeLeg Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Louisa Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > There are people on this thread rendal, who

> openly

> > talk about patronising this establishment, and

> yet

> > on other threads like to wear the 'ethical

> hat'.

> > I'm not making it up to suit my argument, it's

> > true. I just find it painful to listen to

> certain

> > people praising this cinema on the one hand,

> then

> > talking about how they care about workers

> rights

> > on other threads. You can't be a socialist when

> it

> > suits, if you care about social justice then it

> > should be in every thread of your being, not

> just

> > when the moment is right.

> >

> > Louisa.

>

> I'm confused (not unusual for me)...

>

> Do you support things like LLW? Are you saying

> that you aren't a hypocrite for visiting Plex,

> MacDonalds and Harvester? Because for sure they

> don't pay it.

>

> I don't mind if you don't, it's your money and

> your conscience. I'm (honestly) just trying to

> work out where you stand on this issue.

I'm not a hypocrite, I've never visited PeckhamPlex nor have I visited Picturehouse, I have visited other establishments who's LLW status I am unaware of. In principal I support the LLW, but I'm not going to pretended it's something I think about every time I walk into a shop/restaurant. Others on here will go or of their way to reinforce their ethical credentials, then be sneaking into places such as Picturehouse and saying how fabulous it was.

Louisa.

[JoeLeg]

To be honest I'm no clearer on your position re: LLW than I was before. But asked and answered so fair enough.

I do though think it's a bit rich to lecture others on social justice when you're not bothered whether people are paid LLW. By saying that you can visit Plex and eat at MacD's a person is reinforcing support for a world that embraces minimum wage and zero-hours contracts. Now I suspect that isn't a world that you want to see, but you accept a certain amount of 'realpolitik' where this is concerned.

However, I'm just not sure you can level 'social justice' at others if you aren't practising what you preach. Could be wrong though...

[rjsmall]

El Presidente Wrote:

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> There is no way they pay their staff LLW on ?5 a ticket!

Without knowing what rent they pay or seeing their financials then it isn't possible to say this for certain. I would imagine that having being established for some time that their rent is substantially lower than the Picturehouse's.

[titch juicy]

Pardon the naive question, but would Picturehouse not have bought the building rather than renting it? If not, who owns it?

[JoeLeg]

I imagine they'd have purchased the freehold if they could've, but didn't James Barber say in an earlier post that the landlord chose to go with PH?

Unless the price for freehold purchase was so unreal as to make it not worth it. I imagine that a landlord dealing with someone like Cineworld would've happily agreed to a very long lease with no break clause, as it guarantees income for them unless the whole company goes belly up.

[Mick Mac]

JoeLeg Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I imagine they'd have purchased the freehold if

> they could've, but didn't James Barber say in an

> earlier post that the landlord chose to go with

> PH?

>

Yes "If East Dulwich Picturehouse closed Curzon would snap the lease up. When Cllr Rosie Shimell, former councillor Jonathan Mitchell and I were searching for cinema operators we had four interested parties and the Picturehouse won out with the landlord. So I don't see a risk of this boycott in us losing such a valuable local resource. But I do feel concern about a boycott of one cinema when we don't know how people are paid at the alternative."

[edphstaff]

Hello everyone,

I'm a member of Picturehouse staff at East Dulwich and we are going on strike on Saturday the 15th of April at 1pm. Please come along and support us!

Thanks for all the interest and comments so far. I'd just like to offer some more information so that everyone can make an informed decision:

The campaign is about the living wage and other issues. Someone else commented saying that the living wage is calculated based on workers paying rent. The vast, vast majority of our staff don't live with their parents. Only two do.

The vast majority also don't get sick pay. The situation used to be that you only got sick pay for up to four weeks once you have worked for the company for over a year. This has been cut to only one week sick pay after you've worked a year or more. As our place opened just two years ago, only about 5 members of staff are entitled to this.

I and many others have been unwell but have had to come to work or face not paying rent.

We are also on 0 hour contracts and this means when the cinema is quiet (say after oscar season and in the sun - eg now) our hours are cut the the minimum they need us. This makes paying rent and planning for the future very hard.

Picturehosue was bought by Cineworld a few years ago and they said nothing would change. It has and we love our jobs the way they were.

Here's an article in the guardian about us: https://www.theguardian.com/society/2017/mar/22/sir-ian-mckellen-susan-sarandon-back-picturehouse-cinema-boycott-staff-pay

Here's the copy of a leaflet we will be handing out on the day:

Picturehouse members voted I, Daniel Blake as their favourite film of last year. Yet since then Picturehouse have cut sick pay from four months to one month while keeping staff on unfair wages. We don't think this and their other treatment of staff is fair.

Despite the majority of staff at East Dulwich Picturehouse being members of the BECTU sector of Prospect, Picturehouse has refused to acknowledge our chosen union. Instead they recognize the Staff Forum, a union set up and funded by Picturehouse themselves. We have submitted a request for a Living Wage and improved working conditions and Picturehouse have been entirely unwilling to meet with us.

The Living Staff Living Wage campaign began in 2014 where the Ritzy won a 26% pay rise and an agreement to re-negotiate towards the Living Wage in June 2016. The company back-tracked on this agreement and refuse to negotiate at all.

Our requests:

? A London Living Wage (?9.75/hr)

? Recognition of the BECTU sector of Prospect at East Dulwich Picturehouse

? Fair pay rises for supervisors, managers, chefs, sound technicians & projectionists

? Company sick pay for all staff

? Company maternity/paternity/ adoption pay

Cineworld made ?83.8 million profit in 2015 yet they claim that they cannot afford to meet our needs. Picturehouse pitch themselves as an ethical business. They host independent films and sell fair trade goods. All we ask is that they complete the package, act responsibly and treat us fairly. With the combined force of the Ritzy, Hackney, Central, Crouch End, Duke of Yorks and East Dulwich Picturehouses all on strike, we are now the biggest cinema workers campaign in UK history, but we need your support

Here's a link to the facebook event and the text for those of you that don't have an account:

https://www.facebook.com/events/1865628870324229/

*PLEASE COME DOWN FOR 12.30pm TO GREET WORKERS AS THEY WALK OUT AT 1pm*

-------

EAST DULWICH PICTUREHOUSE WORKERS ARE GOING ON STRIKE!

JOIN US OUTSIDE THE CINEMA ON SATURDAY THE 15TH TO SHOW YOUR SUPPORT!

Picturehouse management have refused to pay us Living Wage, they have refused to recognise our chosen trade union, and they have refused to grant adequate sick pay, maternity and paternity pay. And what?s more, they have refused even to meet with us to discuss these matters. Regrettably, we have been left with no option but to withdraw our labour.

Join us from 12.30pm right opposite the cinema where there?ll be music, speeches, a whole bunch of people venting their anger at a company that made ?83.3 million post-tax profit and refuses to negotiate sharing this fairly.

The campaign started last year with just one cinema, The Ritzy in Brixton, and now there are 6 cinemas striking together at East Dulwich on the day. The movement is growing but we need your help.

Please invite friends and share this event. We?d like as many people there with us as possible! There may well be a trip to the pub after too.

See you on Saturday the 15th!

---------

please let me know if you've any more questions!

[ths0105]

I support your right to protest - just be mindful, when venting your anger, that there is a Peppa Pig movie showing at 12.15pm and you will have young children in the building at the time of your protest.

[geobz]

I think you should blame and protest against the Gov. The Picturehouse seems to be doing whatever is within its legal rights as a company.

0 Hour contracts are awful, of course Britain post Brexit will see an increase to that.

Asking for ?9.75 minimum salary is funny. Most retail jobs are offering around ?8 an hour in a much less relaxed environment.

That Cinema has more than 5 employees? WOAH! No wonder... Literally I can't see any possible way that a Cinema of that caliber has that many employees. The times I've been there it feels like a family run cinema with a few small rooms.

Anyways good luck, I feel like your wrong for feeling entitled to wages of ?9.75 and no 0 hour contracts. You don't like it just change jobs, or I don't know vote for a Gov that will give you what you want.

[Otta]

I kind of agree with the post above. This is a pretty new cinema, presumably you applied for the jobs knowing full well what the pay was?

[rendelharris]

geobz Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Anyways good luck, I feel like your wrong for

> feeling entitled to wages of ?9.75 and no 0 hour

> contracts. You don't like it just change jobs, or

> I don't know vote for a Gov that will give you

> what you want.

ths105 Wrote:

> I support your right to protest - just be mindful,

> when venting your anger, that there is a Peppa Pig

> movie showing at 12.15pm and you will have young

> children in the building at the time of your protest.

Absolute peak EDF, one be grateful for what you've got and one "please somebody think of the children"! Stone me.

Good luck with your demo edphstaff, unfortunately have a commitment that day or would have gladly joined you. But just be mindful, when venting your anger, that for some people it's more important that their little treasures go to the movies than that there's any sort of social justice!