Toilet from hell! (Illegal toilet installation)

[lousmith]

Our upstairs neighbours have illegally installed a toilet that is leaking sewage into our downstairs flat. I informed the council at the time that is was an unauthorised installation and they said "We'll send the landlord a letter" but nothing further was heard and the installation went ahead. Now that the toilet is causing a major problem by leaking brown water into our flat, I'm having no luck with the council as they seem reluctant to intervene in any way. Can anyone advise on what I can do in this situation? Thanks!

[tiddles]

contact the building inspector at the council -were they who you spoke to originally?

try Councillor Barber - I'm sure he would find out who to talk to

sounds horrendous so best of luck

[Phlox]

If you work from your flat, try the Health and Safety Executive.

If you tried the Council, and went through the complaints procedure, then contact the Local Government Ombudsman now.

[lousmith]

Thanks Tiddles. I have tried councillor Barber, who was initially helpful, but when stonewalled by the council has stopped returning my calls or emails. I have raised a stage one complaint, to address this and other issues concerning behaviour of upstairs LH which was dealt with by the local housing officer, but we were effectively fobbed off, indeed received a net sanction about leaving our bike in the hall. We are at our wit's end. I am going to try to raise complaint to a stage two with the aid of the CAB. Waiting to hear.

[lousmith]

Thanks Phlox. As mentioned above, I am trying escalating the complaint procedure to a stage two, which will be heard I believe by an independent panel.

Looking into the HSE avenue.

Thanks again.

[Phlox]

I think if they ignore you for 8 weeks, you can go straight to the Ombudsman.

[lousmith]

Thanks Phlox. I'll look into it.

[Phlox]

Have you considered calling You and Yours, Radio 4? Anna O'Neill is a reporter there, and for BBC London. She did a story on the Solomons Passage flats.

[lousmith]

I was definitely thinking of going to the local press.

I didn't catch that story. I would have thought the worries of a single leaseholder would not garner that much national interest. It's so difficult though to be productive when I have this gnawing situation that never resolves itself. (this is just the latest in a series of awful situations)

[Phlox]

Anna O'Neill has an account on here, and her BBC email is [email protected]. Southwark News covered Solomons Passage. the reporters name was Owen Sheppard.

[Pugwash]

Try Owen Shepherd at Southwark News or any of the staff - you can email them.

[lousmith]

Thanks Pugwash. I'll give them a try.

[KidKruger]

what's an unauthorised installation ?

unauthorised by whom ?

have you tried asking the tenants above to not use (if they've an alternative) toilet in their flat ?

[lousmith]

Unauthorised by the council. They are leaseholders, as am I with LBS being the landlord. All alterations that affect the structure of the building need prior written consent.

"The lease says that you must ask the council?s permission if you want to make any alteration to your home. This includes things such as changing the bathroom or kitchen fittings, because they are the landlord?s fixtures and fittings ? although the lease makes you responsible for looking after them.

"In general we will not refuse permission, provided that what you want to do is done to that part of the premises demised to you, and does not affect the structure of the building..."

The cast iron toilet stack, which is definitely considered part of the structure has been smashed off above the existing first floor toilet and replaced in plastic into which a new second floor toilet has been plumbed. The issue is that a pressure balancing pipe exists which nowadays terminates in our bathroom wall somewhere but is now subject to brown water seepage when the second floor toilet is flushed.

I phoned the council as the guy was about to heft the sledgehammer to smash 100year old perfectly serviceable soil stack to try to get them to intervene. They didn't want to get involved. The upstairs LH verbally threatened me whilst I was on the phone to the extent that the council, on hearing it, recommended I call the police. Later when I tried to get the promised witness statement, they went silent, refusing to answer my questions or return my emails...

[Phlox]

Can the leaking pipe in your wall be removed?

[JohnL]

Does that pipe actually need to be lengthened as it's for balance

I might not know what I'm talking about :)

[lousmith]

The main trouble is the pipe is all original cast iron, which doesn't lend itself well to modification. All the above could be achieved in plastic, but it would require removing the entire stack, including excavating it from the walls and the sewer and re-plumbing all the toilets. it would be far easier to remove the offending toilet and make other provisions for it.

The council would have most likely rejected permission to do the work as LHs are not allowed to affect the structure of the building or allow works to negatively affect other occupants.

Although I seek a pragmatic solution, the main point is that I tried to get the council to intervene before it went ahead, and they actively failed to do so, which gave their tacit approval to a contravention of building regulations, and one that has caused me considerable distress.

If it was the only cause I had for distress concerning the LH, then I would probably just wear it, but there is a history of vile abusive language, threats, intimidation, appalling building methods, workmen defecating in by passageway, you name it, I have suffered it. Three contractors have so far come and looked at the pipe and thought it beyond their ability to fix. When they do finally get round to fix it, I will be charged half of the cost, effectively subsidising his shoddy work. So mainly I am furious, and want someone to do something about it.

The council refuse to answer my reasonable questions, even to respond to my request for the building insurance provider's details to make a claim for damages incurred. Rant over. I am trying the CAB route, stage two complaint, then the press if that doesn't work.

[Lynne]

Surely the Health and S issue can't be ignored?

[lousmith]

You'd think right.

[Delainie]

It sounds so awful, I would certainly contact the press for sure, and do everything by email or letter by recorded delivery. Include photos of damage.Surely this is a health risk. Southwark council are really a joke, they usually pass most work that leaseholders want to do because they get paid for it, regardless of damage caused to adjoining neighbours. If I had a neighbour or neighbours like that I think I would have been arrested by now, no way would I let them get away with sewerage leaking into my home. Really Sorry to hear what sounds like hell. Maybe when all is sorted sell up and get away from your neighbours! anything connected to Southwark council is in my experience problematic. Best of luck lousmith.

[lousmith]

Thanks Delanie. It sure has been awful. We can't even sell up and move out as a survey would flag the damp and its cause. Been here 20 years. And yes, I also have been sorely tempted to lump him, getting myself arrested in the process. I fact he has threatened me on at least four occasions, saying i'm going to f**k you up you inbred c**t, once coming round with his brother, forcing entry to my flat and chasing me through neighbour's gardens. The police allowed themselves to be manipulated into believing them when they flatly denied it. It almost feels like a weird conspiracy. Maybe it is.

[Delainie]

Oh my god, him and his brother doing that to you! He is seriously sick in the head, or just an evil scum bag. I really hope you can get it sorted. whatever else is going on in your life, I'd say this needs to take priority and some advice is needed quickly, what a nightmare, I really do hope you get it sorted, our homes are our sanctuary and it saddens me how horrible people can be. Really the best of luck and let us on forum know the outcome.

[lousmith]

Thanks again Delanie. I am starting a stage two complaint via Southwark as I can get free assistance with that, they should have acted to help the situation, but have done zilch. I am out of town for a week from today, so won't be able to reply to any further post until then, but I thank you and the other posters for your words of support.

[stringvest]

Ahh, weird conspiracy indeed. Have nightmare neighbour for NINE YEARS (usual antisocial behaviour, dog starved in rubbish tip of garden with rats, cat starved, noise all hours, arguing all hours, threats, screaming kids (one taken away), so many people in flat at one time that they were pooing in bags and leaving them outside (ending up in my bin). Police, social services, council, 2 illegal sublets (sub-letters both gave letter in saying they was paying rent - but the tenant denies so these are not evidence!). NINE YEARS OF DIARIES ... None good enough! STILL THERE !!

The council can also put acceptable behaviour contract on tenant for life of tenancy you are told, but they are only enforced when monitored, so for e.g., if sub-let and quiet and you haven't someone monitoring then this is void and you start again with the diaries! ITS DIGUSTING always favouring the scumbags.

GET ON TO ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH YOU SHOULD NOT HAVE SEWAGE IN YOUR HOUSE.

[uncleglen]

They are usually classified as 'vulnerable adults'......