Products not fit for purpose - why oh why?

[malumbu]

I am too versed in consumer rights. It can become an obsession. I wonder why others roll over so easy or write to the Guardian when things go wrong. I am saddened at the erosion of local authority Trading Standards Services.

Bur my question is why do we get bad products in the first place, and as a society why don't we care? I had it beaten into me that unfettered free market, with effective competition and informed consumers was the best way to efficiently deliver goods and services. Well this concept seems to be have overturned by recent popularist revolutions (I think I mentioned Trump/Brexit) and got away with it.

But somebody most be specifying/ordering cheap nasty pens from a Chinese factory, pencil sharpeners that don't sharpen, other products that are un-ergonomic, short working life (foot pump from Dyas that broke after one use) etc because people, including me, thin they are getting a good deal. They are making a profit but it doesn't seem to be good for society.

And then we throw them away, wasting resources and creating landfill, and then buy another one. Not learning and breaks a week later.

[Earl Aelfheah]

what I don't get, is that there must at some point be a prototype or first run. At this point, someone must think 'oh, it doesn't do what it's designed for... hmmm... let's go into production anyway'. That's the weird bit. When something is only designed to do one thing (like a pencil sharpener), which it cannot do - how does it still get into production?

[Lowlander]

Agreed.

There was a good article in the Graun recently praising some companies for their exemplary customer service (e.g. Lakeland replacing a faulty electric blanket after 5 years) https://www.theguardian.com/money/blog/2017/jan/07/key-to-good-customer-service-just-do-it-timpson

Otherwise it's mostly down to increasing disposable income; back in the day people would get someone round to fix their tv, and it was relatively easy to replace the filaments in a toaster.

Nowadays it's cheaper for companies just to replace the broken product rather than fix it.

Whilst a ?7 kettle may last for 10 years, the likelihood of it dying within the first 2 years is quite high. And who is going to complain about a ?7 kettle?

[Jenny1]

Was it in the 1970s when people first started talking about 'built in obsolescence'?

[Angelina]

It is very much a disposable society that we live in. And this is always driven by consumer choices.

Admittedly, our suppliers make it look as if they are giving us a choice by offering A, B or C...... but we should remember we can also demand X, Y or Z

Of course they'll make a kettle (or whatever it is) that needs replacing - it means they get more revenue. It's not rocket science. It's our choice as consumers to allow this to happen....supplier's do not have to be in control.

[KidKruger]

I think the prototypes and first runs/editions work OK (financial suicide otherwise), then the supplier of part/material changes or costs have to be cut for cheaper inputs or there are (for various reasons) failures in quality control and weak products get through to the customer. It could well be that at a later time (under different circumstances) the same product may well be fine again. But some time after that may again be compromised.

An example for me was Halfords inflatable double beds for camping. Bought one, it deflated in early hours of morning in a tent, pumped it up next day and that night it deflated again. Took it back and asked for a replacement.

Same thing happened again. I started questioning myself and why I can't even inflate a simple double airbed successfully. Took it back and got a refund. Couple of years later (last summer) bought exactly same product when caught short on a camping trip and no other option available (knowing I could at least get a refund if it fails - which I expected, a few hours sleep being better than none). So far it's remained sturdy and has lasted months since at our holiday home without needing pumping up.

[DaveR]

"....why do we get bad products in the first place, and as a society why don't we care?"

The simple answer is that we get bad products because we don't care i.e. we continue to buy products where the price is so low that we are effectively on notice that it's probably not going to work, either very well or at all, and even after finding that out we fail to learn from experience. In that sense the market is working perfectly - the demand for crap stuff is there and is being supplied.

I suspect that part of the reason is that we have become accustomed to lots of stuff constantly falling in price (either in absolute or relative terms) due to technological developments and more efficient businesses, so we expect this to be the case across the board. But pencil sharpeners have pretty limited scope for this, so the only way to make them cheaper is inferior materials and production processes.

And I guess another reason is that really cheap stuff encourages a 'use once, throw away' mentality.

[red devil]

DaveR Wrote:

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> And I guess another reason is that really cheap

> stuff encourages a 'use once, throw away'

> mentality.

It's usually cheaper to buy a replacement than to repair a product...

[Angelina]

'Don't care' is exactly right.

It's the same reason we buy washing powder that has a clear large warning on the side saying 'dangerous to environment'

yes - go look at your Persil Automatic (or what it is you use) - it's probably next to the warning that says 'Keep out of reach of children'

[Alan Medic]

malumbu Wrote:

>

> But somebody most be specifying/ordering cheap

> nasty pens from a Chinese factory

The Chinese have to import the balls for ball point pens. Just something I read recently.

https://www.marketplace.org/2015/12/10/world/why-cant-china-make-good-ballpoint-pen

[uncleglen]

Fairy liquid is also dangerous to the environment. I was told that all soapy products are bulked out with salt. Sawdust is used to bulk up jam for example.

The general attitude to the environment is appalling and unless individuals take responsibility for their own behaviour en masse then no amount of legislation will make a difference. Given that we are bombarded with cheap stuff and adverts 24/7 and have been for decades and that you are a nothing of you do not possess mountains of shyte...it is not surprising

[red devil]

uncleglen Wrote:

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> Sawdust is used to bulk up jam for example.

I Googled this, closest result was this post :)...

[Lynne]

I saw an interesting article about the bloke who founded the Tiger chain of shops. He's Danish and said he was horrified on coming to Britain to see that Cheap equated with Nasty and Badly designed, so he's tried to do something about it. With some success, I think. He thought it was because of the class system here - If you're poor, you should be grateful for anything.

[Loz]

red devil Wrote:

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> uncleglen Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

>

> > Sawdust is used to bulk up jam for example.

>

> I Googled this, closest result was this post :)...

Cellulose (which is sometimes made from wood pulp) is used in many foods. But jam ain't one of them. Completely safe and rather a decent source of dietary fibre.

Trying to frame benign ingredients in the form of their origin is not sensible. Otherwise the cake you layer your (sawdust free) jam on will have been made with aborted chicken fetuses, contain ground up seeds and the sap from members of the grass family plus the glandular secretions of a cow.

Or eggs, flour, sugar and milk as you know them.

[Jenny1]

One of the appealing things I found about New Zealand was the way in which people tended to get things mended, rather than replace them. And it was economically viable to do this. So when the zip on my nice rucksack gave out my friends immediately knew to take it to the local chap who made yacht sails and repaired anything remotely canvas. The bag's still going strong nine years later - and actually the zip the repair man put in was much better than the original. I suppose it's easy to understand why this would be the case in a remote country which has a long history of having to be self sufficient.

[JohnL]

malumbu Wrote:

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> are un-ergonomic, short working life (foot pump

> from Dyas that broke after one use) etc because

I brought a footpump that broke after one use - but then I

got a more sturdy double pump in ALDI for less money and it's

still working (so its not always price)

Also

My Doctor Martins I brought in 1980 for 9.99 developed a tear

after 6 months which my mother sewed up (really well). Now I

still wear them occasionally (fashion permitting) after 37 years :)

[Jules-and-Boo]

We still use the hairdryer my nan bought me about 30 years ago. It's still really good.

[malumbu]

Wow, some good posts. Thought I'd just have people taking the pee

I've got a calculator that is 39 years old. Probably cost equivalent of over ?140 in modern money, and a few quid to get something equivalent now. So you'd just throw one away now if it broke. Throwaway society is also because things are so damnn cheap. But there again an I-phone 7 isn't cheap but I expect most owners want to upgrade within a couple of years.

Anyway mixing my arguments here, and yes get some bloody good deals at Aldi/Lidl

[siousxiesue]

buymeonce.com/

[Burbage]

red devil Wrote:

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> > Sawdust is used to bulk up jam for example.

>

> I Googled this, closest result was this post :)...

I suspect uncleglen is from a time before Google. But, as this letter from happier times attests, it was turnips that were used to bulk up jam. The wood was used to make the artificial raspberry seeds.

[Angelina]

plastic rice in China.....

[JohnL]

Loz Wrote:

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> red devil Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > uncleglen Wrote:

> >

> --------------------------------------------------

>

> > -----

> >

> > > Sawdust is used to bulk up jam for example.

> >

> > I Googled this, closest result was this post

> :)...

>

> Cellulose (which is sometimes made from wood pulp)

> is used in many foods.

There's this ...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xylitol

https://soulbia.com/products/crossogue-preserves-sugar-free-gooseberry-jam-142g

"industrial production starts from xylan (a hemicellulose) extracted from hardwoods"