A general thread to discuss Trump

[intexasatthe moment]

I agree Jenny ,I think they'll just use Flynn to distance themselves .And I guess you're right about the Republicans ,proving Trump correct about the swamp .Sigh .

I located the story about not visiting Russia ,it was re a Michael Cohen https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/01/michael-cohen-it-is-fake-news-meant-to-malign-mr-trump/512762/

[Jenny1]

I see. That's an interesting article. So all connected with the Christoper Steele dossier. I wonder how he's getting on these days!

[red devil]

Trump made the mistake of falling out with his own intelligence agency. They will *know* most stuff on him and his entourage...

[jaywalker]

Yes, that is exactly right. Poor Donald, death by a thousand cuts. This has 'out of control' written all over it. The various agencies he has infuriated will see to it that he is impeached I think: they have only gotten started.

Poor May, too. Was she not briefed?

[Jenny1]

I think Reince Priebus may be next for the chop (for different reasons of course).

This really creepy recent tweet from the eye-popping Kellyanne suggests she's positioning herself for the Chief of Staff job

'I serve at the pleasure of @POTUS. His message is my message. His goals are my goals. Uninformed chatter doesn't matter'.

[Jenny1]

...although I suppose it might be a defensive move in the face of a possible ethics inquiry.

[Jenny1]

This is very funny

http://nymag.com/thecut/2017/02/nighttime-voice-mails-from-the-white-house.html

[Loz]

Jenny1 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I think Reince Priebus ...

His name sounds like Spoonerism at work!

[Jenny1]

They love a peculiar name, don't they, these Americans?

[intexasatthe moment]

Yes ,those names .Add to the surreal quality of it all ,like watching a film .

My brain really isn't up to all this ,but Trump was well aware before his innaugration that discussions with Russia needed investigating .How can he ( rhetorical question ) claim that it's just now that he's lost confidence in Flynn.

See this old news about it http://edition.cnn.com/2017/01/10/politics/donald-trump-intelligence-report-russia/index.html

[intexasatthe moment]

And I don't want to overload this thread with humerous links ( so easy ) but this is about Trumps handshaking style .

The "Trump Pump " .http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/02/14/donald-trumps-handshakes-like-man-aggressive-confusing-secretly/

[Jenny1]

The Telegraph article is fun! And I think the humour is an important part of the story, because so much that should be considered and responsible is being turned into farce.

[intexasatthe moment]

Trump and Russia - I have zero idea of the legitimacy of any of these claims but they sound believable to me .

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2017/1/9/1618540/-Was-Donald-Trump-bailed-out-of-bankruptcy-by-Russia-crime-bosses

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2017/2/14/1633577/-Manafort-Page-Flynn-Trump-Russia-is-the-one-story-that-can-bring-them-all-down

and I know nothing about The Daily Kos https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daily_Kos

[Jenny1]

I think there are lots of confusing and tangled threads in the whole 'too close to Putin' story. I would say the point now is to get Congress to properly investigate the things we already know about. Any thorough investigation into the Flynn affair might well start to turn up other links.

I'll have a thorough read of the articles you've linked to a bit later intexas. Thanks for keeping a thought provoking conversation going!

[intexasatthe moment]

I'm not sure I'm actually contributing anything Jenny ,just raising questions and hoping for reality checks .

I've not read this properly but lots about investigating the whole links with Russia thing and how any Flynn investigation would just be a part of that .

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/02/michael-flynn-resignation-congress-investigation/516633/?utm_source=atltw

[intexasatthe moment]

I've copied this because it seems to me such a ridiculous response to a question about anti semitism,almost unbelievable .

Q ? ?Mr. President, since your election campaign and even after your victory, we?ve seen a sharp rise in anti-Semitic incidents across the United States. ?And I wonder what you say to those among the Jewish community in the States, and in Israel, and maybe around the world who believe and feel that your administration is playing with xenophobia and maybe racist tones.

And, Mr. Prime Minister, do you agree to what the President just said about the need for Israel to restrain or to stop settlement activity in the West Bank? ?And a quick follow-up on my friend?s questions -- simple question: ?Do you back off from your vision to the end of the conflict of two-state solution as you laid out in Bar-Ilan speech, or you still support it? ?Thank you.

PRESIDENT TRUMP: ?Well, I just want to say that we are very honored by the victory that we had -- 306 Electoral College votes. ?We were not supposed to crack 220. ?You know that, right? ?There was no way to 221, but then they said there?s no way to 270. ?And there?s tremendous enthusiasm out there. ?

I will say that we are going to have peace in this country. ?We are going to stop crime in this country. ?We are going to do everything within our power to stop long-simmering racism and every other thing that?s going on, because lot of bad things have been taking place over a long period of time. ?

I think one of the reasons I won the election is we have a very, very divided nation. ?Very divided. ?And, hopefully, I?ll be able to do something about that. ?And, you know, it was something that was very important to me.

As far as people -- Jewish people -- so many friends, a daughter who happens to be here right now, a son-in-law, and three beautiful grandchildren. ?I think that you?re going to see a lot different United States of America over the next three, four, or eight years. ?I think a lot of good things are happening, and you?re going to see a lot of love. ?You?re going to see a lot of love. ?Okay? ?Thank you

read more: http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.771992

[jaywalker]

Well, someone is doing the leaking and it's not Snowden.

The deep-state exists and it is terrifying. Way beyond the 'military-industrial complex' now. It may end up being far more of concern than Trump (who, we may come to think, is just a smoke-screen: for when he is impeached or resigns an illusion of 'sanity' will prevail, the perfect mask of power). Obama has some responsibility here.

[jaywalker]

This is the most incisive article I've found on Trump this week:

https://www.lrb.co.uk/v39/n04/david-bromwich/act-one-scene-one

[Jenny1]

Hi intexasatthemoment. I think that's just his standard response to most questions - no matter what the subject matter. I won. I'm great. Everything used to be bad. Now everything will be great.

There seems to be a strong push among American activists to get Congressional Republicans to step up to do some real oversight ....but as discussed previously most are happy with the status quo. It'll need a powerful movement indeed to change their minds.

[Jenny1]

They're now talking about deploying ground forces in Syria. It looks horribly like that classic tactic of sending troops into combat to provide a distraction from your own mess up.

[Jenny1]

Hi jaywalker. Thanks for the lrb link - I'll have a read when I get a chance later.

I disagree with your concerns about the 'secret state' though. The 'intelligence community' isn't perfect and requires oversight and regulation - but given the way the world functions it is needed.

I should think both the FBI and CIA are deeply concerned about Trump's own lax approach to security - as demonstrated by his antics at Mar-a-Lago at the weekend. The way he does business makes him a considerable risk to national security.

[Earl Aelfheah]

I agree with you Jaywalker that leaks from the security services / permanent state, aimed at undermining an elected official are pretty alarming. Whilst I am far from a fan of Trump (to put it very mildly), these leaks are pretty not acceptable. If they were aimed at anyone other then Trump (say, Obama for example), there would be a lot more people speaking out against them IMO. For the security services to be releasing this stuff points to some real problems.

[Jenny1]

Hi intexas. I had a read of your Kos articles. They're interesting. But I would see them as adding to the general somewhat confused picture of what Russia/Putin/White House links might exist - and which of those might be of concern. I think that's why we need a proper Congressional inquiry. It seems that that looks more possible as the days go on - as this Boston Globe article suggests.

http://www.bostonglobe.com/opinion/2017/02/15/something-rotten-white-house/cQe5866sEqGmR55RzOGzPI/story.html?event=event25?event=event25

And please see the same article jaywalker and rahrahrah for why I think the 'leaks' aren't the story. The intelligence community monitor ambassadors calls (that's why they knew Flynn had spoken to the Russian ambassador). They told the justice department what they'd heard (not a worry as far as I'm concerned). This then led the acting attorney general to raise concerns with the White House that Flynn, having broken the law, could be vulnerable to blackmail by the Russians. Not a sequence of events that I regard as sinister.

[JohnL]

Trump tweet

"The real scandal here is that classified information is being given out by "intelligence" like candy.

Very un-American."

In fact the below article seems to say it is very american - from Deep Throat on.

http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la-oe-mcmanus-flynn-leaks-20170215-story.html

[intexasatthe moment]

I thought it's length rather detracted from some of the points it was making ( but I have a small brain ) .I agree completely that the Democrats are no opposition . McCain seems to be the only person standing up to Trump .And these bits chimed with me .

"If Obama often seemed an image of deliberation without appetite, Trump has always been the reverse. For him, there is no time to linger: from the first thought to the first motion is a matter of seconds; the last aversion or appetite triggers the jump to the deed. And if along the way he speaks false words? Well, words are of limited consequence. What people want is a spectacle; they will attend to what you do, not what you say; and to the extent that words themselves are a spectacle, they add to the show. The great thing about words, Trump believes, is that they are disposable. " - but the people might just get catch on if it turns out there are more words than action. A lot of love is going to put a stop to bad people who comit anti semetic acts ? Crime is going to be stopped ? Method seems to be missing ?

"The voters have come to understand that the big banks, along with investment companies like Goldman Sachs and transnational corporations, are sovereignties as powerful as states and in some cases more powerful. By vesting a billionaire with extraordinary power, therefore, the voters are going straight to the relevant authority and cutting out the middle man ? the politician."

"Trump likes the relationship of money to power in Russia ? and specifically of financial power to government authority ? more than he admires anything special about Putin, whom he has never met and about whom he knows little. "

And I loved the rhetoric of his last sentence

"The entertainment of the autumn, when a would-be Caesar held us fast in our seats by mixing forbidden truths with his lies, has already glutted the heartiest appetite, but the exits are closed and we are still in the first scene of the first act."

I liked Wollfe in the Guardian yesterday https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/feb/14/mike-flynn-resignation-trumps-nightmare-begun-mar-a-lago ,but that's because I'm hoping Trump will go even though I fear Pence .

Though Bromwich in your link Jay gives me hope when pointing out that Trump will be in breach of the constitution regarding emoluments if his hotel is used by foreign dignatories .