Street lights (too light!)

[Earl Aelfheah]

Southwark Council changed the street lights in the road were I live recently. It now never gets dark. Several people, on visiting my house, have commented on the fact that it is wierdly light at night. I imagine it's a bit like a Scandanavian summer, where the sun never seems to go down. Anyone else noticed this?

[ladywotlunches]

Its the same where I live - the street lights are on all night. Some people have said that this improves security, but based on the fact we have a street light and an illuminated road sign right outside our house and have had petrol stolen several times in the last few months from a scooter, this doesn't ring true.

Surely in these eco-friendly times, a timer system to turn the lights off after 1am or something would save more electricity? (and therefore money for the council?)

[kford]

http://yourfreedom.hmg.gov.uk/restoring-civil-liberties/reduce-the-luminosity-and-number-of-street-lights-and-security-lighting

[Mrs Y]

Hi

As far as I am aware the street lighting improvements as you state are partly for improved security particularly in colour recogntion using white light which consists of the most recent cost effective system currently available. Opposed to the old yellow and orange type lighting. I assume this is the weird light you refer to, and without it you may have lost the scooter not just the petrol, anyway this is an inner London urban area where else would a decent lighting scheme be better placed. All power to the council for the improved lighting I say. May I suggest if you have a particular problem with light pollution you contact Southwark and ask if some form of shading can be fitted to any offending lantern.

[kford]

It's a fallacy that light = fewer crimes. If anything, it creates a false sense of security.

[undergran]

...and the birds sing at midnight on our street!

[James Barber]

Hi kford,

The link took me to some very strange ideas.

Where street lighting had been modernised - which is East dulwich ward is virtually every street one yellow sodium light has not been replaced with three lamp posts.

This modernisation is to national standards. Where its happened it has seen a dramaric reductions in electrity useagge of around 35%. The white light is meant to enable people to see whites of other peoples eyes and where they're looking.

IF anyone has street lighting shining into their bedrooms then a shield can be added to deflect light away. In the last two years I've arranged this about 3-4 times. Just email me your full contact details to get the ball rolling.

I have enquired about central control of street lights enabling options such as dimming them for set times - costs around ?40 per lamp post. But frankly sorting out the streets that have'nt been modernised has been the priority.

Crime and light levels. Modernising streets lighting is great to help resolve hotspots. Modernisation helps avoid new crime hotspots developing. More effecive is reducing the fear of crime and the more people out and about generally the lower crime levels as more passive surveillance.

[catma]

IF anyone has street lighting shining into their bedrooms then a shield can be added to deflect light away. In the last two years I've arranged this about 3-4 times.

The stadium style street lighting in my street certainly didn't deter the low life who broke in through the front windows while I was away a few weeks ago. However, I am interested in the notion that I can have light deflected as like others it is never dark in my bedroom now. Do I just contact my own councillor as I am in Lane Ward?

[James Barber]

Hi Catma,

You could contact your councillors or email me.

Your local councillors are: [email protected] or Barrie Hargrove or Nick Dolezal.

[Earl Aelfheah]

It's good that the council can arrange shields in order to deflect excessive light, but it might be worth questioning why such shields may be necessary.

I would like to see the evidence that having brigher and brighter streets leads to a reduction in crime. If it's about fear of crime, sure I can see that people feel safer on a street that is as bright during the night as it is during the day. I'm not sure that's a good enough reason for creating a perma-day in SE22.

[DJKillaQueen]

We had floodlights added to where I live a few years ago and they were so bright that I'm sure we could be seen from space. Jokes about 'Close Encounters' were running for weeks! However a word with the council and they were dimmed to a more reasonable level and the angles adjusted to avoid shining into people windows......contact them and see what they can do.

[James Barber]

I'm not aware of any street lighting in SE22 being so bright it looks like daytime.

I've been assured that all new modernised street lighting deployed significantly reduces electricity useage while producing more lumens.

Plenty of evidence that proper street liking goes some way to eliminate crime hotspots in poorly lit areas.

[b-fly]

hmm at least the robbers will see better what are they stealing :P

[kford]

Near my parents' house (in the provinces) the local council erected a new streetlight, for 'crime reduction' reasons, in a quiet cul-de-sac that had been unlit for 40 years. It's now the cool hang-out spot for the local youths, who stay up to the early hours shouting, snogging and boozing. Go figure, or something like that.

[Earl Aelfheah]

James Barber Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I'm not aware of any street lighting in SE22 being

> so bright it looks like daytime.

...Ok, so a slight exaggeration - but only slight. On grey days, the evening can role round and there is little difference at street level (obviously you can still see that the sky is dark). There are certainly no shadowy corners - which I guess is what people find reassuring. Personally, I find it wierd. Streets need to be lit and I'm all for more efficient lighting, but why do we need extra lumens again? You've said that each lamp post gives off more light and a whiter (brighter) light. I believe that the old lamps are not being replaced 'one with another' (i.e. there are more of them). If they're brighter, shouldn't there be fewer? Surely any overall increase in street lighting should be subject to consultation as it effects those living there?

[James Barber]

Hi rahrahrah,

When modernising the street lights wherever possible the lighting engineers assess the spacing to ensure no big gaps between lights. So they've been placing some in different positions. Fewer. They could only have fewer if they were much taller to spread their light or allowed to shine out horizontally which would cause more unwanted light into peoples homes.

[Earl Aelfheah]

Hi James,

So where new street lights have been installed, there are fewer than before?

[Amelie]

There is far too much light pollution in this country.

All yellow sodium bulbs should be replaced with white bulbs, and all street lights should be fitted with blinkers to direct the lightbeam down towards the pavement instead of forming a nimbus around the lamp. All shop owners/commercial businesses/office buildings should be required to switch off ALL the lights both internal and external, including illuminated shingles, as soon as they have finished trading for the door. Estate agents and supermarkets are far and away the worst offenders in this regard. All buildings which have external floodlights should be required to switch them off at 10.00pm.

Children growing up in the towns and cities of the UK have no idea what a starry sky looks like because they never have the opportunity to see one.

[James Barber]

No, I'm not saying that. In some places I'd imagine fewer and in others more.

[Earl Aelfheah]

So where there are a greater number, of brighter street lights being installed, should there not be consultation with people living in those streets?

[indiepanda]

Well, there's more lighting in my street than there was before and I have to say I am much happier for it when coming home from a late night out. There was one section of the street where it was very dark previously despite it being in front of a row of houses. Admittedly my first floor landing is very bright now, but since my bedroom is on the second floor it doesn't affect my sleep.

[shebe]

Suggesting that street lights should be switched off at 1a.m. (i.e. overnight, when it's dark) kind of misses the point....

If you're being kept awake by the light, and a light-deflecting shield isn't an option, heavy curtains, a blackout blind (Ikea) or an eye mask should do the trick. (You may look like Dick Turpin, but won't have your beauty sleep disturbed by the light, artificial or otherwise).

[louisiana]

The shape of things to come?....

Op-Ed Columnist

America Goes Dark

By PAUL KRUGMAN

Published: August 8, 2010

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/09/opinion/09krugman.html

The lights are going out all over America ? literally. Colorado Springs has made headlines with its desperate attempt to save money by turning off a third of its streetlights, but similar things are either happening or being contemplated across the nation, from Philadelphia to Fresno.

Meanwhile, a country that once amazed the world with its visionary investments in transportation, from the Erie Canal to the Interstate Highway System, is now in the process of unpaving itself: in a number of states, local governments are breaking up roads they can no longer afford to maintain, and returning them to gravel...