Extended Breast Feeding - advice on how to stop.....

[The Nappy Lady]

Hi all,

Please no comments on breast vs bottle, or the merits of how long one should breast feed for....

My eldest stopped BF at the age of 16 months with no fuss, but 2nd time around I see to have a breast milk addict!

Little C is going to be 2 in 6 weeks time and although I have loved breastfeeding her I feel it is time to bring it to an end for a number of reasons, however, she is one of those babies that really LOVES breast feeding and I would appreciate help and advice on how best to bring it to an end with minimum stress for her and me.

In a nutshell, I had got down to 1 or 2 feeds a day (morning and pre bathtime) in June/July but then on holiday in Spain she was pretty much free feeding (hard to do anything else when scantily clad around the pool) for 3 weeks. I really think she considers my boobs to be 'hers' rather than mine.

Since getting back a week ago we are pretty much back on track, with a big 30 minute plus feed in the morning on waking, and a feed between 6-7pm (usually only 5 minutes or less, but comes back for a bit more as and when she feels like it). Post bath time she goes to bed without another feed. Also if I'm not at work she'll have a feed pre her lunch time nap by preference, but will go down without it - easier if I'm not the one putting her down though.

She requests 'booby' as she calls it a lot during the day, but can usually be distracted provided I don't remain sitting in our usual place, where she will just go on, and on, and on, crying and wailing and asking which I find very stressful. Sometimes you can tell she's just trying her luck in the way she asks for it, and I can literally just ignore it.

She will drink milk or juice from a beaker, and likes it, but prefers breast. Sometimes sits on me breastfeeding and drinking from a beaker alternately!

Also, when she isn't with me she's fine without. Has even - back in March time, stayed away for 24 hours including of course an overnight with her Godmother without any problems, came back lunch time next day very happy. But when I'm around she wants it.

What would you do? Cut out feed by feed - lunch, evening and finally the big morning one, or go cold turkey? Am thinking if all else fails I might try to get either my sister or MIL to have her for a week in October to break the habit in one foul swoop, but even then I reckon she'd come back and 'ask'.

Any help or advice much appreciated. I'm a big softy and under pressure tend to cave in to make life easier all round, but really do need to stop now, not least to rebalance relationships as my poor hubby is desperate to be loved by her, and at the moment he gets very rough treatment at times, especially in the mornings if he goes in rather than me, and she just screams because she wants me not him. Not easy for any of us.

Help....

[Ruth_Baldock]

Obviously I don't have first hand experience, because Baby Baldock is only 8 months. HOWEVER, my Mum was an extended breasfeeder with my sister and brother('till she was 3.5, a year of this she tandem nursed with my brother). She nursed my brother for a very, VERY, VERY long time (I think he was still at it when he was almost 6(!!!!), but he has ASD and Mum thinks this has a lot to do with it...). I remember her 'weaning' my brother, J. She did it cold turkey, and said it was 1-2 days of utter misery but on the third day he said 'Nursings?' and she said 'No, darling. Lets have some moo milk and an orange instead...' and he obliged. From time to time after that, he asked but when she said no, he would accept it and move on.

[supergolden88]

A friend breastfed until her daughter was at least 3 if not older. When she finally decided to stop she phased out the 'regular' feeds and made sure her daughter was busy and spending some time away from her. Once she had one feed a day on her hands she explained that there was no more milk and offered alternatives. Initially there was some resistance but within a week her daughter her forgotten all about it. If you can spend some time apart then it would be easier on you I guess... Good luck

[The Nappy Lady]

The thing is it is so much harder to stop once they are truly old enough to understand and voice their opinion so clearly. Though I suppose being able to explain a bit helps, but still it does make me feel very mean. Have to put my selfish "I have a life too, apart from being your Mummy" head on I think to get through this one.

[nymom]

I just want to sympathize with you. My son is 2 years and 2 months, and I am expecting another baby in November. My son loves breastfeeding and I honestly do not know how to stop. I really thought when he turned 2 I would do it, but we were away visiting my family for 6 weeks and didnt want to try it there. We have been back for a month and the end of August deadline I set for myself is rapidly approaching. Like you Molly my son demands it, and now will say "just ten seconds"! He thinks my boobs are his and wants to hold them all the time as well! Like you also I have my son down to a feed in the morning, and my husband puts him to bed now so we could stop the evening feeds. During the day he will beg for it if we are home, and especially if he hurts himself. The boob is the only way to soothe him. I have no solution to offer you but wanted you to know you arent alone. If anyone has any other advice I would appreciate it! I feel so guilty trying to stop as he loves it so much, but I would love a small break before starting up again.

[Saffron]

Oh dear, I fear we may be headed this way with Little Saff, who is very much a "boobie baby". It seems so harsh just to whip the proverbial rug out from under a little one all at once. And, I wonder if that wouldn't also leave the child feeling as if he/she had done something wrong and was being punished in someway, or was somehow less important/less worthy of love? (Imagine if one day out of the blue, someone you love said I'm never pouring you another tea/wine/coffee/etc ever again?!)

I have a friend who has an older nursling. They stepped down from one feed a day everyday, to feeding just once on Saturdays. This seems to be working pretty well for them at the moment.

I wonder also if you could reintroduce a warm bottle when you phase out the breastfeed? ...easier then to phase out the bottle later, than to go cold turkey on the boob?

Curious to see what everyone else's thoughts are...

...best of luck,

Saff

PS: Has anyone asked a certified lactation consultant for advice? Just a thought.

PPS: Another thought... Once you've worked the feed down to 1/day... if your bubs is old enough to start grasping numbers, offer 50p for every day that s/he takes a beaker instead of the boob. At the end of the week, this could total (a whopping!) ?3.50, which could serve as the pocket money standard for some years to come. Help your bubs keep track of progress with a star chart, and never take stars/money away for bad behaviour, so as not to mix this paradigm up with any other behavioural contexts. This means that giving up the boob can only ever lead to a reward.

(Scary feeling I'm route mapping my own future here!)

[snowboarder]

We've cut down to 5 second morning feed and maybe 10 mins at bedtime but I'm now stuck! Admittedly junior snowboarder is younger - only 16.5 months - but I need him to stop now for a number of reasons - not least because I want an night away!! It's weird as he has never been super keen on b/f - always quick and often reluctant, but it's such a part of the bedtime routine I don't know what to do - and he wont drink ANY milk out of a cup at all - so his 10 mins pre bed is all he gets. I even tried to bribe him with a cup of hot chocoate (spat it out and cried). Sorry not helping - just sharing!

Molly I have NO idea but the way we stopped all those horrendous night feeds was cold turkey....argh...

[The Nappy Lady]

Thank you nymom, I really do appreciate your post. I feel this is a real 'heart vs head' dilemma.

Saffron - some good ideas there - mine never accepted bottles, but I could try warm milk in a beaker. Love the pocket money idea, but think she's too young - would work with an older child though I'm sure.

Am going to try to phase out feeds over the next few weeks.

Would be so much easier if my emotions didn't keep see-sawing, I guess it is because I know this is really the last time...but she really isn't a baby any more and it is TIME TO STOP (I chant to myself!!).

[GinaG3]

We are in newborn mode with breastfeeding right now at 19 months I might add, I know its going to be so hard to stop so sympathize with you 110%. I don't want the day to come where I feel I may have to wean her instead of her doing it herself. I hear a lot of women have success stories from actually not being around during the day for a couple of days, don't have experience of this myself yet though I'm afraid.

Good luck with it :) I hope it goes well.

[littlebelka]

I simply cut off feeds at 18 months. There were tears and quarrels, but in a week time everything was OK.

[cuppa tea]

I breastfed my first until over 2 yrs. We did it really gradually by cutting down the feeds until we were on one a day. Then we dropped that one and said "milk all gone" (or something to that effect) I think we did get a couple of minor tantrums, but it passed in a couple of days. At least I can't remember it being that traumatic for anyone. I think that going away for a few days possibly makes it harder on the child, as they do not have the comfort of the boob or you. And actually it is ok to say "no" now that you feel it's time to stop.

[agathoise]

Hi Molly

a couple of books you may find useful are "How Weaning Happens" by Diane Bengson and "Mothering Your Nursing Toddler" by Norma J Bumgarner both available from Amazon UK or La Leche League Books; both are available to borrow from your local LLL group. Both books have lots of ideas for gentle ways to cut down nursing, or to stop nursing if that's what's right for you.

You might also find talking to other mothers in the same situation, or who have been in the same situation helpful. The local La Leche League group currently meets near Blythe Hill, and you'll find both the Leaders (qualified bfc) and other mothers really helpful. LLL's philosophy is that each mother and baby dyad is different, and these differences must be respected: nobody will tell you to keep breastfeeding, or to stop breastfeeding. What you will get is shared experience, and accurate information -- and a nice chat with other mums! More info here: http://lalecheleagueselondon.blogspot.com/

The La Leche League International website has some interesting articles in the links section: see http://www.llli.org/NB/NBextended.html for a page of links to articles about extended breastfeeding including quite a few about weaning -- some are first person experience, others link to scientific studies.

Sorry this is brief and all impersonal, but my four imps are keeping me rather busy at the moment! Fwiw, I've only weaned one of mine, and I used bribery (mini-milks and biscuits: "would you like boobie OR would you like an ice-cream?" Ice-cream won out every time!): I was desperate for a short break before the birth of my fourth child. That child (#3) had the shortest nursing duration at 22 months; the older two weaned themselves at 24m 1wk and 29 months. The youngest is still nursing at 19m :-) It might seem like your little one is going to nurse forever, but I promise you she wont!

Don't lose sight of all the wonderful mothering you're doing, and what a great behaviour you're modelling to your daughter by being so sensitive to her needs. Big pat on the back for yourself!! :-)

Hth

Agathoise (semi-retired BFC)

[Saffron]

Thanks, Agathoise. Great info, and I'm sure I'll be referring back to this thread when Little Saff is a bit older. And thanks, Molly, for starting a thread on such a tough topic!

x -Saff

[The Nappy Lady]

Thanks guys, really appreciate all the support.

DH being fabulously helpful - only one morning feed all day yesterday, and same today so far at least. Keeping busy so no time for tears or tantrums thank goodness. Boobs quite full this morning - not like newborn days, but was glad to feed her & she stripped both in minutes, then proudly said "all gone Mummy!"

Fingers crossed we are well on the way now.

Molly

[MrsMc]

The 'milk all gone' ploy worked with my 2 year old nephew. Understandably, he was a little miffed to begin with but v soon got over it. I guess if it's presented as something you can't do anything about rather than you wilfully withdrawing feeds then it's easier to accept? My sister in law cut down gradually to one feed a day before taking this tack. Good luck!

[Whisper]

A breastfeeding story as related by my dear friend J....

When J's daughter R was nearly 3 years old, J woke up one morning and thought, "Blimey she's not a baby anymore. I can stop breastfeeding now." J got all her sisters together and they went down to beach to sing songs and celebrate little R's birthday. They sang "bye-bye boobie" to the tune of Bay City Rollers "Bye-Bye Baby". Then J gave her daughter a bunch of helium balloons and told her, "When you're ready to stop breastfeeding, you let go of the balloons." R let go of the balloons and then burst into tears, but after a little while it was all ok.

The next morning when R crept into her mother's bed and asked for boobie, J reminded her about their little party the day before. R's reply? "I was just joking, Mummy!"

[The Nappy Lady]

Ahh, that's so sweet.

As for us...well, we did it.

Right after my posts on her at the end of August we got down to just one feed a day (first thing in the morning). That went on until the day before her 2nd birthday, but was becoming a shorter and shorter feed. I had planned to give her the 'last feed ever' on the morning of her birthday, but her Dad got her up, took her downstairs and gave her a beaker. The next day was a Monday and other than a brief murmer of 'boobie' as I took her straight down stairs she accepted a beaker instead just fine, and has really only mentioned it a couple of times since. I was worried about what would happen when she next saw me naked, but just avoided it for a few days, and now all she does is laugh (with good reason!!) and point out various parts of my anatomy!!

So, I never got to do the final feed I had planned, but in a way I'm glad about that.

What is brilliant is I can now take proper medication for coughs and colds and things, it shows my age that I am more excited about this than the prospect of being able to drink large amounts again, which I think has been conditioned out of me!

[Jane68]

Ruth_Baldock Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Obviously I don't have first hand experience,

> because Baby Baldock is only 8 months. HOWEVER, my

> Mum was an extended breasfeeder with my sister and

> brother('till she was 3.5, a year of this she

> tandem nursed with my brother). She nursed my

> brother for a very, VERY, VERY long time (I think

> he was still at it when he was almost 6(!!!!), but

> he has ASD and Mum thinks this has a lot to do

> with it...). I remember her 'weaning' my brother,

> J. She did it cold turkey, and said it was 1-2

> days of utter misery but on the third day he said

> 'Nursings?' and she said 'No, darling. Lets have

> some moo milk and an orange instead...' and he

> obliged. From time to time after that, he asked

> but when she said no, he would accept it and move

> on.

ASD - acute stress disorder - won't be due to the extended feeding, but may not have been helped by the abrupt termination.

I wouldn't say that even 6 years is excessively long. In some parts of the world, especially where clean water is scarce up to 8 or 9 is not unusual, and it doesn't seem to do any harm. Extended feeding seems to go along with availability. If the mother dries up then weaning naturally happens earlier.

[Ruth_Baldock]

No, Autistic Spectrum Disorder. Low functioning, specifically. I meant that the link between his autism and bf was the need for routine and consistency and he was so used to having his nursing sessions at specific times of the day etc.

It felt excessively long to my Mother, and I know she wanted to stop when he was 3, really.

[sillywoman]

HI Molly, I haven't read the whole thread so apologies if I'm repeating advice already given. I can only yell you what worked for me with my breast milk addict.

As he approached his 2nd birthday (& after a year of lying to my Mum about his continued feeding cos she made it clear it was disgusting - but that's another thread entirely!) we, like you, were down to a couple of feeds - morning & evening. Then I began to insist that when he wanted those feeds we went to the same place to do it. For us it was his bed in his room, but anywhere away from the rest of the house - and therefor anything interesting that might be happening - will do. After a week he dropped the morning one, by two weeks the evening one. I did feel a bit sad as he's definitely my last so there was an 'end of an era' feel to it. But it was definitely the right time for us.

HTH a bit.

SW

[The Nappy Lady]

Thanks SW - we are sorted now - she had her last feed the day before her 2nd birthday - dropped pm feeds, then finally morning feeds about 3 or 4 weeks later. It was sad...but was the right time, as you said.

Now drinks up to 3 beakers worth (8oz a pop) of cows milk in the morning instead (what an addict)!

[GinaG3]

sillywoman, thats sad you had to keep it secret from your own mum. Breastfeeding is one of the most natural things in the world and its soo good for baby. I don't understand some peoples views but realise everyone is entitled to an opinion..

[sillywoman]

Thanks for the sympathy GinaG3. Mum is old school & actually a bit crap. Was warning me of the perils of breastfeeding - the words 'rod' & 'back' were mentioned - when sillygirl was 36 hours old. Hmmm :-S Not a case of 'mother knows best' I think!

Sorry Molly, didn't see your post that said you'd finished. It's bittersweet when it happens though isn't it?

[Ruth_Baldock]

Sillywoman, I can relate. Baby Baldock isn't even 11 months old and I was told by...ahem...a 'family member' that when elderly relatives were over, I had to either feed him from a bottle under the pretence he was full-time bottle fed (we're mix feeding him. Actually, now he only gets 3x boob feeds a day, he's 99% breastfed. I digress...) or I had to go and hide in the downstairs loo (not bedrooms, as one of the elderly mad may stumble upon me...) because it was 'outrageous' to be feeding him past 6 weeks!

Expletives were used. My own family are huge hippies and we were all practically breastfed until our A-Levels, so my Mum is fully supportive of my desire to let Baby Baldock wean at his own pace (never at this rate. He's a boob man, allright). It's horrible when people make you feel like a freak for breastfeeding, especially those of you who are meant to LOVE and SUPPORT you!