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I agree that peculiarity is not the sole preserve of religious fanaticism.


There is indeed fog, created by the Iranina authorities it seems. She was never tried for murder, but instead retried for adultery (which supposedly happened after the death of her husband - so how can it be adultery?) even though she'd already been tried for it, found guilty based on a confession she gave under duress, and punished with 99 lashes (which were carried out).


The retrial coincided with a trial for murder of one of the men she is supposed to have had an affair with and he was found guilty but somehow she was also found guilty of murder AND manslaughter (according to the Iranian authorities) but was handed the death sentence for adultery only. And then a warrant for arrest was put out for her lawyer so he had to flee.


What kind of judicial system is that?


Iran's response that it's some plot by Western governments to 'make them look bad' is infantile imo and the citing of the case in America of a woman given the death penalty for hiring two hit men to murder her husband so that she could claim insurance is a poor comparison given the differences in the two judicial systems and the burden of proof required in America compared to Iran.

Saudi Arabia is intolerant of any other religion besides Islam. Essentially we are talking about religious fascism in those countries, but it is a fascism imposed by the views of the leaders - rather than being a symptom of Islam. Essentially a dictatorship is a dictatorship whatever the nationality or religion or otherwise.
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I wouldn't say that oppression of woman in Iran primarily compromises their intelligence, the key issues are the comparative constraints on their behaviours and engagement in an Iranian society that is dominated by males in many aspects.

Intelligence is surely there already or it's not (within limits obviously and allowing for the benefits of 'academia').


I would say the potential women are prevented from reaching is their ability to participate evenly and equally at all levels in that society and therefore in their ability to engage in those respects with their counterparts from nations around the globe. As a result Iran is surely preventing ITSELF from reaching it's full potential.


Edited to say I just noticed your comment was about middle-east, however my comment is still valid I think, just applicable to middle-east now and not just Iran.

In fact Iran has very good education for women. Many women go to University for example. But it's that they have little opportunity to do anything with their education afterwards that is the problem. Some of that is social tradition....and some is ideoligical religious politics. But in terms of educating women...Iran scores higher than most Islamic nations.
Yes I agree with both you two,its not only those countries where women are limited in what they may do. They have no real say about who they can marry ,or even if they can have a career. Imagine being covered head to foot ,having your physical freedom curtailed in that way.Some places in the world still practice female mutilation, The men bully and batter them, even their own daughters, They wont let them look or speak to other men, yet its ok for them,they are not supposed to look at naked women. but they still sell "Nuts magazines ,etc.in their shops. Whats happening to that woman in Iran, is not far off to what is happening to a lot of women living over here. Primitive treatment of women. Who can say honor killings are ok.
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Whether we like it or not, 'face' is a very important concept in some cultures.


Whilst publicity probably saved this woman initially, it might be wise to let this drop off the front pages so that the option to change her sentence can be done without losing face.


Having said that, no-one knows the truth behind this case, it's also possible that this woman was behind the murder of her husband.

I believe you are right about that, its sad that pride ,can do so much harm. Like honour killings. To us it is barbaric. I,m not even sure if its anything to do with religion either. Some old tribal thing,that is ruining life.I thought the Persians were a bit more modern thinking. than the Iran they have now.I have a few friends from the time of the szar. and they dont think that way at all.

Iran is a young republic, born out of a genuinely popular revolution and a subsequent political and religious terror.

It still has to find it's future path to the sort of country it wants to be.


There has been a quiet struggle for the centre of power that's been going on for the best part of 25 years that hasn't ended yet.


Cases like this inevitbly have to be seen through that lens. Who is trying to appeal to whom, what power base are you trying to shore up, and ultimately what is the real end result once the the rhetoric and posturing is over.


I've said before that Ahmedinajad's usurpation of the presidency wasn't the real battle, but the one between the religious power, the executive, the legislative, and of course, the people, is ongoing, and i hope for Irans sake it can be resolved within the political realm.


Here's a short but succinct article that sets it out nicely.

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2010/11/24/is_this_really_the_end_for_ahmadinejad

  • 2 weeks later...

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