Sleep with newborn - if you had it to do over again

[reren]

I just read a few of the recent posts regarding trying to get babies/ toddlers to sleep. We are expecting a bundle of joy/terror in about 8 weeks time. I know there's no avoiding being massively sleep deprived for months (at least)but I wondered what tips people had / if you had it to do over again from the time the baby was born - what would you do this time round to try & get your baby to sleep?

Our current plan is that we'd have the baby in a moses basket in the bedroom for the first few months - transferring him at some point to his own bedroom when we feel the time is right. Going to try hard not to nurse to sleep (but is this impossible with a newborn??) - as I've noticed all my friends who've done this are still up multiple times in the night (I also wonder if this is actually a bit of a chicken and egg thing - if you've got a baby that has trouble sleeping is nursing them to sleep inevitable - i.e. its not the nursing to sleep that is actually the problem)

My inclination is not to follow a really strict routine - but work out our own routine and then stick to that - but again - I have no experience of any of this - would be really interested in what you have found works well? And whether there's anyway to establish a routine with a newborn - or is that something that needs to wait until 3 months +?

[Fuschia]

I read a study into links between early behaviour and later sleep patterns, the key thing seemed to be a certain amount of "neglect" ie letting the baby grumble itself off to sleep from quite early on. Though whether those babies later woke any less (or whether the parents just didn't rush in) is a bit unclear.

I think everyone has a different tolerance to a crying baby...

Anyway the key tip I think is to try as much as possible to put the baby down still awake, to go to sleep itself. How you go about that don't ask me, mine have always fallen asleep feeding/lying on me!!!

[Fuschia]

PS for the first 4m they sleep randomly but most of the time, I think after that they become more wakeful but also you can discern/encourage more of a pattern

The first 4m are pretty much about finding your feet, getting to know each other, and for the baby, learning the world is an Ok place

[bumpy]

Currently have a 7.5 month old and the one thing I'd do differently if I had another baby is not rushing to fit him/her in to a night time routine at 3 months old - why I tried to heaven knows - think it was because all my friends who have older children kept telling me how important a routine was and not to create a rod for my own back. After a couple of weeks of trying my brain returned and I decided to 'listen' to my baby rather than everyone else around me. I'd agree with Fuschia and just go with the flow for the first 4 months or so and with any luck you'll both naturally fall in to a routine that suits you both. :-)

[sanity girl]

Put baby down in cot awake - don't let them fall asleep on the boob and then put them down to sleep - that's what I'll be attempting to do differently this time around!

[womanofdulwich]

I would say that giving birth although very rewarding is a huge thing. Once you have had a baby I think the first 2-6 weeks you cannot lay down any rules and you hopefully will have partner/family around to concentrate on you, while you concentrate on baby. Your recovery after the birth is hugely important- as you get to grips with your bundle of joy. Do not underestimate how tired you will be and do not try and look after the house, just concentrate on your baby and yourself. After that it depends on what kind of person you are, but I do think you should not put your baby in the cot when they are asleep- always let them fall asleep in their cot.

[ratty]

Just goes to show that all babies are different. For us it was routine, routine, routine from 4 weeks old. Baby slept through at 3 months or a couple of days before. Afraid there are no rules it would seem! Best if luck!

[Fi from West Dulwich]

Good advice all. I would also say don't read any books, especially not The BAby Whisperer - I dearly wish i had never set eyes on the ruddy thing, the book had me desperately trying to disassociate sleep from feeds for my poor little newborn who, it transpires, it a suckler through and through. Some babies are, some aren't, and if you have one, no amount of 'discipline' will change their inclination at the early stage, unless you make them go cold turkey and do the dreaded controlled crying (please please please don't listen to any wellmeaning friends who offer that solution either, studies show raised cortisol levels from prolonged stress are, unsurprisingly, damaging). Find out what your baby wants, and then try to accommodate it as much as possible - eg sleeping in sling, or, dare I say it, in your bed. we swore we wouldn't and guess what, we did and LOVE it! even, in fact especially, my husband. So i suppose to conclude my rambling post is not to write yourself rules before your baby even arrives, but learn with them, and be gentle on them and on you, to give you both the best possible start. I wish i had not spent so long trying to put O down when actually all he wanted was to suckle himself to oblivion. He won every time of course, and quite right too, but i could have saved a lot of heart ache had i just stopped and listened to my instincts. good luck!

[randomv]

I think the key is to learn the different cries that your baby makes. For months I thought my LO was waking every hour crying because he was hungry so I fed him back to sleep. It was only at 8 or 9 months when he was fully weaned onto meat and I knew he wasn't hungry or had anything else to make him cry that I was brave enough to do any sort of sleep training. What I quickly learned was that the cry he had been making was because he was overtired. He didn't want to be fed, or cuddled or rocked..he wanted to go back to sleep but had forgotten how to do it. HAving gone through that process, it was then immediately apparent what he needed so on those rare occasions he did wake I could tell straight away if I needed to rush in and comfort him, or leave him to grumble for a few mins.

Also I think that routine is key - that's coming from the first 8 months of going with the flow I might add - and for us at least things really started to fall into place once I followed a routine.

HTH and good luck!

[crystal7]

Same as others re feeding to sleep. Putting down awake sounds so easy but my daughter used to scream. Also at night i found it impossible not to feed her back to sleep- something in the milk makes you both sleepy?! Also i'll try not to worry about what everyone else's babies are doing!

[sophiechristophy]

I have no issue with feeding before bed. As far as I have found it really relaxes my baby, and isn't a problem at all. In fact, I think it is a really nice thing. And she has slept through on and off since she was 8 weeks old, so I definitely don't think it does any harm at all.

My advice would be to roll with whatever makes your baby (and you) happy and helps them to fall asleep. Don't worry about a routine, or anything. Just trust your instincts.

[Bumpkin]

I know in an ideal world you're meant to make the baby go to sleep without any props e.g. feeding, rocking etc, but we did get a Tomy star which plays a lullaby and projects pictures of teddies onto the ceiling. Not for use in the first few weeks as too much for a real newbie, but it distracted baby B enough to get out of the room without too many tears and turns itself off after 10 mins. We still use it 2.5 years later...

[peckhamboy]

We've found that trying to structure the day around naps has helped settle our daughter into a better rhythm at night. Of course, she's not always co-operative - you can take a horse to water etc...

She normally sleeps around 3-4 hrs in total during the day now though, and since starting to do that has settled quicker at night and slept longer. Of course, it might just be coincidence. Timing-wise, it's (very) loosely based on Gina Ford's routine but we've ignored pretty much everything she says apart from using her rough timings - it's just too much like hard work and seems to create more stress to follow it to the letter! We're trying to put her in her moses basket when she's very sleepy but not asleep, but it's very rare that she will get herself to sleep on her own. She seems to be able to settle herself when she wakes in the night though, so we've been pretty lucky so far. I think so much depends on your baby that I'm sure someone else doing exactly what we do would have a totally different experience.

So, go with what feels right, and reduces rather than creates stress, and you'll find that you've got a happy little family before too long. Just don't have any expectations of sleeping through the night in the first two or three months! And you'll soon realise in any case that "through the night" actually means 11pm-5am, without needing a feed (rather than not waking at all), and not 7pm-7am in blissful silence...

[sb]

.

[ladywotlunches]

I agree with others, some of the books are just far too strict. I did find The Baby Book by Rachel Waddilove helpful though. It gives you a guide for routine, but all the way through emphasises that if it all goes pear-shaped, it doesn't matter. Quite a reasonable approach I found - am now due with my second and have been reading up again.

First time round, we kind of just let ours do what he wanted for 5-6 weeks, then started trying a routine. Mainly to try and get some evening time back! I think he slept 'through' (I think 10-11pm to 6 ish) from about 4 months. He's a good sleeper now at 4 years, and to date we've not had massive problems (I hope it doesn't change will arrival of no 2!!)

[randomv]

sophiechristophy Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I have no issue with feeding before bed. As far as

> I have found it really relaxes my baby, and isn't

> a problem at all. In fact, I think it is a really

> nice thing. And she has slept through on and off

> since she was 8 weeks old, so I definitely don't

> think it does any harm at all.

>

I think the point i intended to make about feeding to sleep is that there comes a point where it no longer works consistently, in the case of my LO at around 8 months, and he became a very upset and over tired little boy who could not get to sleep at all which isn't very useful for anyone concerned! I'd have found it pretty impossible not to feed to sleep very early on, but I think after baby no. 1 I can be far more attuned to what the tiredness signs are (rather than clutching the Baby Whisperer book and desperately trying to decipher what each movement or cry meant, as I was in the early days!)

[supergolden88]

I have been wondering the same thing myself having had a baby that did not sleep through till 13/14months (she woke up every night. A lot). Now due with second end of October I have been reading all my manuals again and I have to put in a recommendation for this one

Baby Secrets

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Baby-Secrets-Know-Babys-Needs/dp/071814709X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1282049628&sr=8-1

It has a routine that is a guideline only and not set in stone like Gina's and it just seems sensible advice all round. Putting baby down awake seems to be the biggest secret around and I know it's almost impossible to do. But if I had to revisit my mistakes from four years ago I would say rushing in to pick baby up the minute they make a noise is definitely not something I would do again. And I will try to avoid breastfeeding to sleep past the first couple of months as I think my daughter used it as soothing well past the time she needed the milk.

[Fidgetsmum]

What will I do differently? Well, firstly, I wouldn't wait till breastfeeding is excrutiating until seeking help. I also wouldn't let myself get as low mentally as I did again without seeking help. Looking back, I just refused to accept I wasn't coping but this time, if it happens again, I won't hesitate to seek help from everyone! I would definitely have my next one in a moses basket for 3 months in our room like we did with my daughter and, maybe for the first two or three nights in our bed (but no more - I didn't sleep a wink for fear of squishing her!).

And we'll definitely refer to The Baby Book by Rachel Waddilove which, as someone else on here has said, gives you a routine but gives you the skills and acceptance that sometimes routine is the last thing on your baby's mind and that it DOESN'T matter. I ended up using the book from 6 weeks till she was 2years and it was great for me and my daughter - she really thrived following (vaguely) the routine that Rachel Waddilove advocates.

Other than that, I think all would be the same - but I can see that all babies can be very different so who knows what this next one will bring!

[Moos]

I liked the Waddilove book too, but thought it was quite old-fashioned in its approach. The constant 'don't worry!'s were great!

However, she does advocate a 4-hourly routine which seems a bit of a stretch for a very small one.

[Sanne Panne]

Agree about putting baby to bed while still awake being the best (but also most difficult) thing. I can't let a small baby cry so I'll just keep trying and hoping to get it right at some point (baby being tired but not overtired, baby being "ready" to fall asleep alone without crying - with our current baby that was at 5-6 weeks old). Right now I will let her make a few little complaining noises but I'll pick her up if she sounds remotely upset. I still put her in her cot after feeding/rocking her to sleep most of the time (or let her nap on my lap/shoulder) but am hoping to slowly transition as we also have a toddler running around. Our toddler was a horrendous sleeper as a baby, only improved at 6 months - this one is much easier or maybe we can "read" babies a bit better now.

[damzel]

Not letting them fall asleep after a feed - this was the best advice I was given but a few people on here have suggested that it's actually difficult to do. I didn't find it too much of a problem though - of course she fell asleep feeding sometimes, but I just used to change her nappy before her nap so that she woke up, even for a small amount of time. Then she was awake but perhaps still drowsy when she went for her nap. It's so lovely for them to fall asleep on you like that and this way, you have the best of both worlds.

The purpose is for them to learn that they can go to sleep on their own. If they learn this during daytime naps, it naturally follows during the night.

Just to note, this is only important with daytime naps. At night-time I put her in the cot awake or asleep, I didn't try to wake her if she had already fallen asleep.

However, the best advice is to trust your instincts, as others have already said. Good luck.

[sunbob]

I think that it's a lot about trial and error. It depends on your individual baby (as well as the parents). Some babies are what's called 'sleepy feeders'. If your little one is at the digestive stage of being hungry every 2 hours and an 8 minute feed takes 45 minutes because they fall asleep every 2 minutes when on the breast, then there just isn't enough time in the day when they are full, awake and relaxed enough to fulfil the 'ideal' and go into the cot awake. We went through this for several months and it did mean she didn't like going into her cot, but little one gradually matured and we found ways of helping her through and by one year she slept through regularly and was very happy to go into her cot. So don't worry too much about trying to acheive the ideal.

[VeLenz]

With both my children I fed whenever they wanted to the first four weeks or so. It was pretty erratic and I gave myself as much time to relax as possible (many times sleeping whilst they fed in the middle of the night!).

As soon as I felt ready for it, i began to introduce the concept of night time and day time. I decided that seven o'clock sounded like a good time for babies to go to sleep, so at around six thirty i began a routine of bathing/cleaning, changing into a sleep suit, feeding, and putting down to bed at the same time, irrespective of his/her mood or state of sleepiness or wakefulness. I did try and put them down awake, talking to them softly and explaining the situation.

I also did not sleep with my children in my own room. They sleep adjacent to our room and I've never had any trouble hearing them in the middle of the night. I believe this made me more relaxed and as a result i was more rested.

By 12 and 16 weeks respectively, both my children slept through the night.

[trinity]

As a mum of 4 my advice to my pre baby self would be not to look for sleep solutions that suit you instead look for sleep solutions that suit the baby you have. All of mine have needed drastically different things to get them to sleep. There is no one solution which will work for all babies all of the time so the best you can do is arm yourself with alternatives, allow yourself to be flexible and realise that you don't know what baby you have and what it needs until you have it.

[Ewcia]

I could not read all the posts - quite a lot of them - so I do not know if anybody mencioned this. I would recommend you to read couple of books before you decide what to do - I know there is a lot of methods and theories out there but in thouse couple books I wont to recommend you is a lot of sence, ones you have a look you must agree they are based on common knowladge.

Attachment Parenting : Instinctive Care for Your Baby and Young Child http://www.amazon.co.uk/Attachment-Parenting-Instinctive-Young-Child/dp/067102762X/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1282258480&sr=8-2

What Every Parent Needs to Know: The incredible effects of love, nurture and play on your child's development http://www.amazon.co.uk/What-Every-Parent-Needs-Know/dp/1405320362/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1282258672&sr=8-1

The Politics of Breastfeeding: When Breasts are Bad for Business http://www.amazon.co.uk/Politics-Breastfeeding-When-Breasts-Business/dp/190517716X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1282258745&sr=8-1

and there is a book called The Baby Book: Everything you need to know about your baby from birth to age two http://www.amazon.co.uk/Baby-Book-Everything-about-birth/dp/000719823X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1282258799&sr=8-1

this one is like a bible and manual (if one can say that :)) to your baby - tells you everything about their development in details - including types of nappy rash.

I do not have my family with me so I had to learn everything from books and following my instinct and I think it was actually great not to have everybody trying to tell me how to take care of my baby - just follow my heart.

good luck with yours :)