dangerous junction of barry road and underhill rd

[nanki1]

I saw yet another bad accident on Saturday at the junction of barry road where underhill road crosses it.

Really hope nobody was badly hurt. But that junction is really dangerous and there seems to be too many incidents happening there. Something needs to be done before somebody gets seriously injured or killed.

Wondered if anyone knows of a petition where we can request better traffic management at this accident prone spot!

[Mrs Y]

You need to contact Southwark Council on 0207 525 5000 or perhaps one of the local councillors will pick this up!

[DJKillaQueen]

Do you have any figures on the number of accidents there in say the past year. The government has a measure for what defines an accident blackspot.

I personally don't thinhk there's anything wrong with the junction (it's the same as thousands of junctions all over London). Have driven accross it many times. Always stop and never drive out unless the road is clear for me to do so. Most accidents are the fault of the poor judgement of the offending driver anyway...not the junction itself.

[Penguin68]

There are two types of problem with the junction - high vans parking in Barry road by the junction can badly obscure the view looking towards the Plough end of Barry Road from the building site/ old wood yard side of Underhill - this causes cars to edge into Barry to get a clearer view (could be addressed with a well positioned mirror) - the intentional narrowing of Underhill at both junctions means that cars committing to cross the road sometimes cannot enter Underhill because of blocking traffic - exacerbated by lorries delivering to the building site. They thus cannot clear Barry. Narrowing also means that cars turning from Barry into Underhill have the same problem.

All this is exacerbated by poor driving (i.e. cars that signal and then don't turn, or vice versa - inexperienced drivers sometimes 'believe' the signal or lack of it and then commit before being certain of the oncoming driver's real intention).

Problems are worse than for other 'crossings' of Barry because Underhill is a major cut through and of course now a bus route - so it just carries much heavier traffic. The length and straightness of Barry doesn't encourage slow driving either.

[BJL]

There was a bad accident by that junction a couple of months back - a speeding driver lost control, crossed onto the wrong side of the road and hit three parked cars (two were written off, as was the driver's). He was driving so fast that the parked cars were shunted 6 feet along the road.

Many drivers drive terribly down Barry Road. They speed, overtake when unsafe and generally treat it like a racetrack. (It's not helped by drivers who poke their cars out too far when trying to cross Barry Road.) I'm sure that a couple of speed cameras or some traffic calming measures would help reduce the accident rate.

[TonyQuinn]

There have been a number of threads about this over the years and I have noted about this on many occasions. It's not just Barry and Underhill, it's Barry and every other road (Goodrich, Upland etc) that is a concern. Not just that, Lordship Lane and many junctions are dangerous too, particularly Lordship and Goodrich. I've alerted the council to it, and they don't seem to give a monkey's, however many accidents there are.

[BJL]

I agree, Tony - there are lots of other dangerous roads/junctions in ED. The junction of Underhill/Dunstan's is another. Barry Road is particularly bad because of the ridiculous speeding that goes on there.

[peterstorm1985]

I think the primary problem with the junction of Barry and Underhill is the position of the pedestrian crossing such that drivers focus their attention on that rather than any drivers emerging from the side road.

[skidmarks]

The government has cut the road safety budget by ?38 million this year, so unless there is a really significant injury accident not just broken headlights, dented body work and damaged egos I would not expect anything to happen at this junction in the near future.

[mattbrownis]

Driving along Underhill seems to entail trying to crane ones neck around the parked cars in both directions at all the junctions.

Always feel like I'm on borrowed time driving along there.

[DJKillaQueen]

There's not a lot that can be done about bad drivers really. And speeding drivers are a menace but again are found everywhere.

There's no chance of speed cameras after the above mentioned road safety cuts.

The other problem is that Barry Road is a B road...so speed humps and pinch points can not be freely used.

Traffic lights and Pelican crossings might be the best option but whether there's any money for that is another question.

[skidmarks]

A contact at Transport for London has told me that Borris has declared there will be no new traffic signals in London, this includes pedestrian crossings so that will rule this out for this junction. The simplest way to sort the issues is double yellow lines to prevent parking in the sight lines; ?5,000 for the traffic orders advertising and sealing and ?750 implementation, hopefully non of the residents will object to the loss parking..

A mini-roundabout could be considered as that would change the priorities but are pretty dangerous for cyclists.

[BARA]

The Barry Area Residents Association (BARA) campaigned last year for some improvements on this stretch of road. As a car driver, I too hate having to cross over from Underhill - and edge very slowly over the lines so that I can see on coming traffic. The railings by the lights restrict your view when looking right and you cannot judge the speed of on coming traffic.

I am surprised that James Barber has not picked up on this new accident- I will email him for his comments.

[Penguin68]

And well placed steel mirrors would provide much better visibility on key junctions.

[TonyQuinn]

I think that double lines suggestion is very good.....mirrors too would help.

[DJKillaQueen]

Double lines would probably be the most cost effective solution.

[skidmarks]

A highway authority would never install a mirror. All the ones you see are privately owned and installed. To rely on a mirror raises all sorts of issues in terms of safety such as if its knocked out of alignment, dirty, if there is sun glare, if its dark and it is near enough impossible to see cyclists or motorcyclists in them.

As you say everything should be done to improve sightlines by removing obstructions. Southwark could undertake a pedestrian guardrail risk assessment and it is my opinion that the benefits of the railings are undone by the obstructed sightlines.

[Applespider]

skidmarks Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> A highway authority would never install a mirror.

Not always true. TFL has recently installed mirrors at lights along the new cycle superhighways to help the drivers of large vehicles see if a cyclist has (stupidly) come up alongside and is in their blind spot.

[Nicholas]

One very important thing is missing when approaching from Underhill Rd,and that is a painted line and stop sign. I can't believe the council has left it so long, it's a very dangerous junction. I agree, Barry Rd is treated like a race track at times, definately two speed cameras need to be errected urgently.

Im a local driving instructor, and that road scares me. But most dangerous is just trying to emerge from the side roads onto Barry rd. Not only the volume and a speed of traffic as somebody rightly said, you get large vans, cars etc. that park close to the junction and the only way to get out is to edge your vehicle forward just to get a clear view. When you get lunetics coming at you at 60mph plus, you've got no chance. Pedestrians and cyclists are at serious risk.

[DJKillaQueen]

Have never seen anyone doing 60mph plus on Barry Road....45 maybe.

There won't be any speed cameras now that the government have cut the road safety fund...indeed some areas have shut off all their existing speed cameras as a result because they can't afford to operate them.

When cycling down Barry Road I know that cars may no see me before they drive out but I cycle with that in mind and accordingly. Similarly most drivers apply the same common sense when driving.

[Nicholas]

Take it from me 60mph plus is no exaggeration,especially late at night. I know in these times of government cuts there's no chance of speed cameras. Barry Rd is dead straight and almost a mile long,perfect for the boy racers,and motorists who flout the law on a daily basis.Speed cameras would stop morons who use roads like this as race tracks. (SPEED KILLS)

[DJKillaQueen]

Prove it!

Have you stood there with a speed gun?

[katie1997]

KillaQ - I agree with what the others say about this junction, I use this at various different times most days. I don't think those speeds are an exaggeration at all, in fact, it doesn't even have to be late at night to notice this either. Its a very dangerous junction - as are others of course - but as the thread was started about this one, I share the concerns of the original poster that the likelihood of a serious incident here seems increasingly likely.

[DJKillaQueen]

Yeah but the point I'm making is that 60mph is a guess it's not based on any kind of fact - and most people are bad at judging speed (tending to exagerate what they see).

I'd prefer asking for a survey and some statistics based on fact.

I do agree that visibility at some of the junctions is an issue. But you just have to be extra careful. After all, hundreds of motorists negotiate those junctions every day (without any incident) and there are long periods during the day when there is hardly any traffic on Barry Road at all. I'm sure if James Barber or someone could come up with actual statistics on accidents that Barry Road is no worse than many B roads in London and indeed may be much less accident prone than many others.

[katie1997]

precisely - which enables some people (who aren't being extra careful) to travel along that road as fast as they possibly can, getting up to speeds of...oh, lets say about 90mph now since its a guess.

I'm not sure people wanted a comparison between Barry Road and other B-roads in London, more the fact that this particular spot is local to them, they are worried that its getting pretty damn dangerous and perhaps something should/could be done, if possible.