Pregnant woman smoking down Lordship lane!

[Dulwich Born And Bred]

Sean,

On this forum, people can be SO rude, I think the NAME calling is not right. Psycho etc. The OP did not call the smoker names, so I don't think it is right for people to call the OP names. Why can't people just say they think it was not her place to say anything instead of being rude? That is why the 'cowardly' people will PM in agreement rather than voice it on here because they don't want to put up with the backlash.

[taper]

I think if you publish something, essentially a private incident, on a public Forum for no other reason than to get a reaction, then you can't really complain when the reaction isn't one that pleases you.

[SeanMacGabhann]

HH

To a degree I agree with you of course. Name-calling isn?t big or clever and to accuse someone of being mentally ill is a fairly serious accusation. So I?m going to withdraw any such accusation towards the OP

Could I get with saying it was nutty behaviour rather than the individual being a nutter tho?

Also, it is surely semantics to say the OP did not call the smoker names ? her original post used the following

?"I could not help but give her a filthy look, which she reciprocated...

and then I let loose

told her how selfish she was

how disgusting is was to be smoking whilst pregnant

I told her she should be ashamed of herself as well."?

Coming from anybody, I would say those were names. Coming from a stranger it?s abuse

Not to mention the subtext, which is that she is basically saying the smoker is physically harming her baby. A baby-harmer is as bad a name as you can call someone

And it?s all very well saying people on the forum are rude ? how can the OP behave SO badly towards a stranger in ?real life? and then expect people to just say ?I disagree with you??

[Dulwich Born And Bred]

And I think on here people should stop acting like a lynch mob and stop being extremely rude when someone says something that they do not agree with.It is possible to disagree with someone without restorting to playground name calling. I see it happening time and time again on this forum.

[legalbeagle]

HeidiHi Wrote:

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> I am sorry, does Nigeria have a good track record

> for human rights? Who said that Africans are all

> abusers? I did not, I said that in Africa they

> might not have a law for smacking children ( and

> they don't) but in the UK we DO have a law for

> smacking children. Take that how you will.

Sorry, but that's not what you said. Here's what you said:

"He was an African man, so I was telling him that in his country it might be acceptable to beat children since their human rights is appalling, but in the UK it is against the law."

So I stand by my last post. Africa is not a country it is a continent. "They" don't have one law for anything. And it simply does not follow that because a government has an appalling human rights record, it's citizens are more likely to abuse their children.

[Keef]

If you show me where I have been nasty or unpleasant, I'll apologise. I used the word nutter, which is what I'd think if told off by a stranger.

[Vickster]

Sorry HeidiHi, but as has already previously been mentioned, Africa is not a country, so it is very dangerous to make sweeping generalisations about an entire continent. I suspect that you do not know the human rights laws of every country that makes up the African continent, but please do let me know if I am wrong. While I applaud you for standing up for this child, your method of rebuke of the father was questionable.

HeidiHi Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I am sorry, does Nigeria have a good track record

> for human rights? Who said that Africans are all

> abusers? I did not, I said that in Africa they

> might not have a law for smacking children ( and

> they don't) but in the UK we DO have a law for

> smacking children. Take that how you will.

[SeanMacGabhann]

But Heidi, it was the OP who acted as the lynch mob (judge, jury and verbal executioner) to a complete stranger

By comparison, people on here are restrained!

It?s not just the original incident ? anyone of us can lose our rag on the wrong day and blow off steam at some unsuspecting person. But there is a complete lack of any balance or remorse since. What are people MEANT to say?

It is staggering that someone can behave so rudely in real life, and start a thread about it, only for other people to be accused of rudeness

[Dulwich Born And Bred]

Is it bad that I think it was selfish and she should be ashamed of herself for smoking? The evidence was there, huge baby bump and the lady smoking?

I don't class that as name calling, I just class that as truth. If it was me and someone said that to me, I would be offended, and anger but I could hardly deny that I was not selfish and that I am not potentially harming my baby?

I don't have no problems with people smoking, pouring booze down their throats, etc because they are adults, it is their bodies and their lives, but when it comes to babies, I just cannot stand it when people put their own needs above their babies. I wanted my weekly bottles of wine when I was pregnant, I spent years having a few nice bottles of a weekend,but when I become pregnant, it was no longer about me, and nine months out of my life to not be selfish is not asking for much. But then humans generally cannot resist temptation can they? My sister and my mum would agree with you all and say that we have no rights to say anything since it is none of our business, but I feel differently, if someone wore real fur in public, they leave themselves open to abuse, if someone smokes with a huge bump in public, they leave themselves open to abuse, even if no one says anything, you can bet someone will be tutting or giving them evil looks. The OP just verbalised to the person what most of us would be thinking.

[Dulwich Born And Bred]

I knew he was Nigerian, So I told him in HIS country ( meaning Nigeria), it might be acceptable to beat his kid, but in the UK we have laws for that.

Someone asked me why I said in his country it would be acceptable, I replied he was African. I should have replied, he was Nigerian.

Stop nitpicking. Nigeria DOES have a bad human rights record, Amnesty International if you want to google?

[Bellenden Belle]

HeidiHi Wrote:

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if someone wore real fur in

> public, they leave themselves open to abuse, if

> someone smokes with a huge bump in public, they

> leave themselves open to abuse, even if no one

> says anything, you can bet someone will be tutting

> or giving them evil looks.

No Heidi - nobody should feel their legal actions "leave them open to abuse" in society. We are all entitled to live the life we see fit, provided our actions are not against the law.

A person can passionately support the need for more health education, or can campaign against the fur trade - but that is where a person's involvement should end.

[missus]

But the point is most of us would keep it to ourselves because we wouldn't be so presumptuous as to think it was our right to distribute our opinion. Don't put your actions up for debate if you aren't ready to receive a rebuke or two...

As far as I am aware that woman, whether you think her right or wrong, was not asking for commentary of her lifestyle choices whereas you came on a public forum and asked directly for commentary on yours. I'd just graciously take the fact that there are many who oppose what you did and leave it at that!

Whats more, HH, no one cares if you, as an individual, were exemplary during pregnancy, or your sister or your mother.... why? Because we don't know you or them OR the woman in question OR will ever know the child she produces.

Lig, If you think it's bad then good for you but I suggest you contain your-holier-than-thou attitude within your private messages with your disciples, otherwise it is inevitable that you will get slated, perhaps even personally, which quite clearly you are not finding particularly enjoyable.

[helena handbasket]

igaturiosity Wrote:

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> Just saw a woman brazenly smoking whilst heavily

> pregnant. I could not help but give her a filthy

> look, which she reciprocated...and then I let

> loose and told her how selfish she was and how

> disgusting is was to be smoking whilst pregnant,

> and so publically. I told her she should be

> ashamed of herself as well. This woman was

> rendered speechless but I am glad I said all this.

> My husband says I was wrong to say anything and

> should have minded my own business but I was left

> so mad by what I saw I couldn't help myself. What

> do others think?!!

Okay I'll play along, I think I get the rules now!

You are disgusting. You should be ashamed of yourself. Why are you all so nasty?

Okay your turn! Now you're supposed to be "rendered speechless".

[legalbeagle]

HeidiHi Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I knew he was Nigerian, So I told him in HIS

> country ( meaning Nigeria), it might be acceptable

> to beat his kid, but in the UK we have laws for

> that.

> Someone asked me why I said in his country it

> would be acceptable, I replied he was African. I

> should have replied, he was Nigerian.

> Stop nitpicking. Nigeria DOES have a bad human

> rights record, Amnesty International if you want

> to google?

Not nitpicking at all, just trying to understand your post, which presumably you want to have understood or you wouldn't have posted. You didn't say he was Nigerian. Now you have, I understand better what you were trying to say. Not everyone who questions you is "having a go". Some of us are trying to understand.

It is beyond doubt that Nigeria has a bad human rights record, I am a member of Amnesty and have represented those suffering human rights abuses as a lawyer before now, so I don't need any persuading there. My point is that I question the link between that and child abuse. What you described was a beating and kicking of a child. I am questioning whether this happened because the man was from a country with a bad human rights record, and therefore was likely to harm his child. I know a number of Nigerians who would find that incredibly offensive. They may have suffered human rights abuses but they would never inflict suffering on their children.

In any event, there may not be laws banning the smacking of children in Nigeria, I don't know, but that isn't what he was doing.

[Ligaturiosity]

"super bit of trolling" is pretty nasty Keef. What do you mean I am trolling?

Belllenden Belle, just because something is 'legal' does not mean it is right. Many illegal things which we now find abhorrent were once legal.

I have been advised to go to Peckham and have a go at the women down there. What is that supposed to mean? Are you making this an ethnic or social thing? Why suggest Peckham???? How do you know what ethnicity/social background etc this woman was? Are you assuming that the woman in question was some genteel, organic eating so and so swanning down L/ship Lane having (to quote Keef) a 'cheeky puff'? Nothing could be further from the truth. I have rarely said anything like this to anyone before. This woman and her friend were twice my size and looked quite Vicky Pollard-esque. They could easily have retaliated if they'd wanted to, but evidently could not defend the indefensible.

Sean M, no I am not remorseful. I regret the phraseology of my initial posting as actually I didn't really 'let loose' as that can be construed as being totally maniacal which I wasn't.

Re. Heidi's points. I work with a Nigerian woman who is quite open that she batters her children when they are naughty. I have told her that I do not agree with it at all.

[chantelle]

I'm glad we've clarified that all Nigerians are child abusers!

Many countries don't have laws against smacking. I'd assume most don't. Yet I think you will find very few places indeed where kicking a small child would ever be considered acceptable.

[SeanMacGabhann]

I think Peckham was mentioned because that's where the nearest McDona;d's is, rather than any ethnic reason, Ligaturiosity

The logic being, if you are worried about how parents abuse children through their own thoughtlessness, you have plenty of ammo to do so right there - "look they are making their chiildren fat!!!" - basically, what I said about Gillian McKeith earlier

As for rephrasing your original post, I'm willing to bet regardless of how you THINK you came across to this woman, I bet she thinks you were maniacal. But you don't want to even consider that apparently

[Ligaturiosity]

Chatelle, nobody is saying all 'Nigerians are child abusers'. Why do you have to totally twist what was said?

[missus]

The old offensive defensive comes into play.

You know exactly why Peckham was suggested - because you are more likely to find someone who would not tolerate your superlicious behaviour i.e. rightly told you to f**k off!

[Ligaturiosity]

Missus, How do you know that this woman wasn't from Peckham?????? She may well have been!

[missus]

I know her just as well as you do, m'dear....

[helena handbasket]

Wow.

Ligaturiosity Wrote:

> I have been advised to go to Peckham and have a go

> at the women down there. What is that supposed to

> mean? Are you making this an ethnic or social

> thing? Why suggest Peckham???? How do you know

> what ethnicity/social background etc this woman

> was? Are you assuming that the woman in question

> was some genteel, organic eating so and so

> swanning down L/ship Lane having (to quote Keef) a

> 'cheeky puff'? Nothing could be further from the

> truth. I have rarely said anything like this to

> anyone before. This woman and her friend were

> twice my size and looked quite Vicky

> Pollard-esque. They could easily have retaliated

> if they'd wanted to, but evidently could not

> defend the indefensible.

Or in spite of their outward appearance they actually have more class than to lower themselves to your level?

You want people to stop being nasty to you but listen to yourself. The more you say, the uglier it gets.

[prdarling]

"This woman and her friend were twice my size and looked quite Vicky Pollard-esque."

She was probably rendered speechless because she wasn't even pregnant....

[Ligaturiosity]

That is your opinion Hbasket, and you are entitled to it, as I am entitled to mine.

[Dulwich Born And Bred]

I must stop posting on the East Dulwich forum, correction, I must only post on the classifieds!

Let's all agree to disagree like we do about most things!