Pregnant woman smoking down Lordship lane!

[Peckhamgatecrasher]

"i think we have a duty to protect children from harm, rather than turn a blind eye."

Totally agree - let's all join the UK Life League.

[Belle]

It's interesting - there was a big public outrage when first Kate Moss, and later Kate Garraway were photographed smoking during pregnancy. I admit that like many people I did instinctively flinch when I saw the pictures - and whether or not the outrage that followed was justified is a whole other debate involving fame and what goes with it I guess. But I do think ultimately it is nobody else's business, just as others have said - just as it's nobody's business what her birth plan is, what she's eating/drinking, and when the baby is born, what she will feed it.

I remember being at work functions when I was pregnant and really wanting to have one of my two drinks of the week at them, but being embarassed to be the pregnant drinking lady in that setting. Ridiculous really.

[jollybaby]

Maybe we should look on it in a positive light - the fact that caused such a reaction suggests that it is something that is becoming less common. I used to work in a hopsital where there would always be about 10 pregnant women huddled round the back entrance having a fag (and always in tiny dressing gowns that barely covered their bumps or bums).

Though of course maybe many woman are still continuing to smoke - but in their own homes where they won't have to face a barrage of abuse in the street.

[RosieH]

I would far rather be stunted by an inch in height because my mum had a cigarette when she was pregnant with me than be emotionally stunted and spend my entire adult life in therapy because my mum's a judgemental psycho.

They f*ck you up, your mum and dad...

[helena handbasket]

Lawrence Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I imagine all mothers to be do things others will

> frown upon, ever used a baby walker? Tut.

>

> Personally I would far rather be the offspring of

> an occasional smoker than that of a high strung,

> judgemental psycho who thinks it acceptable to

> berate complete strangers.

>

> Untie Hubby and chill out.

I had to laugh at loud at this. My mother was/is a judgemental psycho. I WISH she had just had the cigarette instead!

And Sean you could not have summed it up better.

[prdarling]

Are you for real? This is the stuff of mentalists.

How can you think it's acceptable to have a go at a stranger on the street for something which is absolutely none of your business? Yes we all know smoking is bad for everyone and I'm sure the woman has it left right and centre from her midwives etc etc but at the end of the day, albeit a totally stupid one, it's her decision and it's not affecting you in the slightest so mind your own damn business and stop being so sanctimonious.

If a total stranger came up to me ranting about something I was while minding my own business and not affecting anyone else, I'd be seriously alarmed about their mental health

[helena handbasket]

prdarling Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Are you for real? This is the stuff of

> mentalists.

>

> How can you think it's acceptable to have a go at

> a stranger on the street for something which is

> absolutely none of your business? Yes we all know

> smoking is bad for everyone and I'm sure the woman

> has it left right and centre from her midwives etc

> etc but at the end of the day, albeit a totally

> stupid one, it's her decision and it's not

> affecting you in the slightest so mind your own

> damn business and stop being so sanctimonious.

>

> If a total stranger came up to me ranting about

> something I was while minding my own business and

> not affecting anyone else, I'd be seriously

> alarmed about their mental health

How much do I LOVE your post prdarling? So very much.

[Fi from West Dulwich]

Hmmm, contentious issue as this thread shows. Socially, you overstepped the mark; morally, I think you were quite right, and I bet beneath the indignation that woman felt ashamed/guilty. Although I wouldn't have spoken out myself (cowardice, too British?) I think perhaps the only way that people will change their behaviour is through being made to confront it by others. Also, people seem to focus on the rights of the mother but what about the rights of the unborn child, who is the most vulnerable person in all of this? I would far rather some social ripples were caused if it meant that the child's safety were protected. I think you were rather brave to speak out in their defence.

[ryedalema]

Give it a rest - poor lady. If having one cigarette (no evidence of more presumably unless she had fags between each finger) calmed her down after a stressful day, surely that's understandable. A calm non-stressy ma can better cope with the rigours of everyday life with a huge bump to carry around.

And yes I totally agree with the poster who said she might have cut down from 40 a day.

Thing is we don't know her circumstances - so who are we to judge?

Someone once publicly chastised me because my sleeping 18 month old was sucking a dummy - fierce she was and left me quaking. Doesn't anyone enduring pregnancy in this heat deserve to do so without public flogging?

I'd have given her my bottled water or fan - not a tongue lashing.

Chill the eff out. Don't you have your own stuff to worry about?

[womanofdulwich]

How can you possibly judge? Are you so perfect that you can stand there and criticise others for one cigarette? You don't know the womans circumstances.

[littleEDfamily]

I agree that an all out rant at a pregnant woman smoking is probably inappropriate, but interested in whether others think it's ever appropriate to step in where you feel a child is being mistreated, which I guess was the OP's motivation for getting stuck in?

The strangers, who stepped recently in Brighton where there was a young baby getting sunburned were hailed as heros.

Now, I am not saying smoking one or two ciggies while pregnant is the same as letting your baby get 3rd degree burns (although heavy smoking during pregnancy is almost certainly going to compromise your baby's health), but I wonder where those of you who have argued vehemently that people should mind their own business would draw the line. Does it need to be a baby/ child and not a foetus, and does the child need to be in immediate danger of death?

[Harsh-but-Fair]

Wow What a sad lot we have here.

The fact that someone dare speak out in favour of the unborn child is fantastic.

Th OP is IMO acting socially responsibly. I was brought up in a smoking household and now have asthma I wish perhaps the same had been said to my parents.

A few harsh words to a smoking pregnant woman must be balanced against the millions of carcinogens leaking into the placenta causing temporary oxygen deprivation and possible longer term lung and brain complications to the foetus. No contest in my view. I'm not for a Nanny state but come on for f**** sake it's not rocket science there is a time to pause or pack in the fags and the time is when pregnant.

[Belle]

I don't know if someone having a go at her is going to change her behaviour though is it?

[chantelle]

i admit to being shocked when i met the wife of an old friend and she was 8 months pregnant with a fag in hand. after being pregnant myself, and reading so much about what is ok or not, I have more compassion for people and their decisions, and i also seem to recall a recent study saying smoking in late pregnancy is scarcely harmful at all.

[Harsh-but-Fair]

Well it might make the woman ashamed enough to think seriously about alternatives such as nicotine patches or quitting.

Fortunately you don't see many heavily pregnant women walking around smoking. I don't care if the one the OP is on about had

one or 50 fags. What she was doing was wrong and she deserved to be criticised. My mother smoked throughout her pregnancy and as I said I have asthma and get a lot of chest infections. My sister had a really low birth weight. All these things are linked to smoking. My mother was pretty selfish and always prioritised her smoking. I seriously wish someone had had the gall to rant at her about it, and maybe my health would be better as a result.

Babies are innocent beings smoking/drinking excessively/taking drugs while pregnant are a form of child abuse; the child has rights even though unborn. Someone should stand up for them since they can't.

[Harsh-but-Fair]

Don't know where you got that info that it is 'scarcely harmful at all' to smoke in late pregnancy Chantelle since smoking limits the nutrition that a baby can receive. This can be particularly detrimental during late pregnancy, when the baby's brain is developing rapidly. There is also a growing body of evidence that nicotine has a direct damaging effect on developing nerve cells. In animals, even small doses of nicotine injected into the mother during pregnancy resulted in brain malformations, poor functioning, and learning problems. (No one knows what effects the hundreds of other chemicals in cigarette smoke have on a fetus, but they can't be good.)

[giggirl]

Just to clarify, nobody on this thread has suggested that smoking is OK. Nobody has suggested that it's OK for a pregnant woman to smoke. It's not a good thing. That's a no brainer.

Again, just to clarify, we know NOTHING about this smoking pregnant lady or her circumstances. What we do know of the incident is the OP's report which was this:

Just saw a woman brazenly smoking whilst heavily pregnant. I could not help but give her a filthy look, which she reciprocated...and then I let loose and told her how selfish she was and how disgusting is was to be smoking whilst pregnant, and so publically. I told her she should be ashamed of herself as well. This woman was rendered speechless but I am glad I said all this. My husband says I was wrong to say anything and should have minded my own business but I was left so mad by what I saw I couldn't help myself. What do others think?!!

Now, call me old fashioned, but I do not read this as a passer by interceding in order to protect an innocent child/foetus, I see it instead as someone simply venting spleen. She probably made herself feel a whole lot better by venting, but so what?

LittleEDfamily raises some interesting points though about when it?s appropriate to step in, and the Brighton incident is certainly a good example. But passing judgement on someone and giving them a piece of your mind ? serving no purpose but to vent spleen ? that?s not a good thing.

[Ligaturiosity]

Thanks to those who have given a reasoned response to my original posting. It would seem I had murdered someone the anger some are showing towards me. I didn't 'attack' this woman or act aggressively. I merely said that I was shocked and appalled by seeing her smoking and pregnant. It's true I felt both those things. I really don't care if people say it wasn't my place to say anything. Maybe it wasn't, but I did and I don't regret it. I love babies and think they owe it to us to give them the best start in life. It makes my blood boil that some people can be so selfish for just 9 months.

Call me judgemental? Ha! I am indeed. But aren't we all? Quite so.

[Saila]

I used to smoke (heavily) and every time i was reminded about how bad it was it just made me want another one...

Smoking is as addictive as heroin. Ask any smoker whether they would rather not smoke and they'd mostly reply YES

Shouting at someone who clearly knows what she's doing is wrong will (IMO) just make her light up again

If you want to start a campaign about something you have to go about it the right way, or no one will listen. So i'd offer to work as an educational midwife and stay well out of publically humiliating someone with a hardcore addiction.

[chantelle]

ok, i should never have mentioned my unsubstantiated claim of some study that I think i saw in the press. I do see that there was a study showing smokers have lower rates of preeclampsia, which is a bit odd.

anyway, i certainly don't support smoking but i still think it's wrong to tell someone off for it. people standing outside the offices of doctors in the US who perform abortions, harassing patients and staff, are just protecting unborn babies too, but that attitude doesn't go down well with a lot of people who support women's right to choose.

[helena handbasket]

!

[helena handbasket]

>

> Call me judgemental? Ha! I am indeed. But aren't

> we all? Quite so.

I know I'm judging you right now.

People are calling you judgmental because you came on here asking for judgements. You just don't like the way it turned out.

[Ligaturiosity]

How do you know I don't like the way it turned out? Yes I did ask for people's opinions and expected that not everyone would agree with me. I do happen to have an inkling about how people are likely to respond on here you know, even though I haven't posted in ages. However, just find it amusing to be referred to in such vitriolic terms such as psycho etc. Hilarious!! :) I think you should reserve such judgements for the people who murder and stab - and there are a few who have a penchant for such activities round here.

[helena handbasket]

Oh good, another circular argument. Just spent the weekend with my mother so a bit stocked up on crazy for the time being.

Off to clean the toilets.

[giggirl]

I disagree - I think you were aggressive. You instigated a confrontation with a pregnant woman. That's aggressive. I see also that you've toned down your reporting of the event and what you said since your original post.

I don't think people have shown anger towards you; I just think people are quite horrified by what you did.

It makes my blood boil that some people can be so selfish for just 9 months.

Once again, let me say, we know NOTHING about this woman. NOTHING. Do you know for a fact that she has been smoking for 9 months? You know NOTHING. The only thing you know is that you saw her have one cigarette. Anything over and above that you're just making up to serve your argument.

Call me judgemental? Ha! I am indeed.

Nobody is arguing with you about the smoking thing, the issue that several posters seem to have is with you being so judgemental. And yet you seem so very proud of it. You are not a perfect person and you are not a perfect mother. Remember that and be more thoughtful before judging other people.