Can you be chastised for alleged 'poor' performance during pregnancy?

[ryedalema]

I'm going back to work soon and have been having keep in touch days, which mainly consist of meetings with my boss (four now). At each meeting she's emphasised a few incidences of poor judgement/confidence on my part which will be reviewed 'properly' in my appraisal. This is on my third day back (deferred from January when I was on mat. leave). When I've asked her to give me details of the incidences she has been really vague and said she won't mention names but that I've been abrupt and sometimes lacked judgement in the tone of my dealings with senior colleagues - my CEO is one of them and she has asked me never to approach him direct again. That will mean that I have "a very challenging time when I return to work"- her words.

I know of a couple of incidences early on in my pregnancy when I've snapped at people, then immediately said sorry as I'm incredibly remorseful when it comes to stuff like that.

She's also kept saying how wonderfully my interim has done "but don't let that worry me as she's a different person".

I'm feeling seriously unwelcome - and actually said that to her yesterday. She said "if I'd wanted you to leave I'd have told you".

Now - I'll hold my hands up to any incidences of poor judgement/confidence before my pregnancy (April 2009 onwards) but what are my rights after that - does anyone know?

I'm feeling seriously anxious about going back to work and quite frankly don't think she is helping me with my 'confidence issues' by repeatedly talking to me about this.

Can anyone help?

[Ruth_Baldock]

Whats your job, out of interest?

Pre-baby, I worked as a learning and behavior mentor at a secondary school and the SENs Team Leader (my dept) was AWFUL with things like this. The straw that broke the camel's back was an incident where she left a list of things to bring up at my next appraisal which was basically a bulletpointed list of my faults. We had a shared office and everyone saw it. Nice. I went to HER manager, the deputy head, who dealt with it, as I said I didn't feel I could bring it up with Team Leader (very volatile lady, she was). Are you part of a union at all? If not, and if in doubt, refer upwards to manager's manager.

Good luck!

[kristymac1]

Sorry to hear you're having this kind of response from your employers, unfortunately I have too much experience (ie one experience but that was far too much) of this type of behaviour - have pm'd you. x

[Smiler]

How awful, that must be stressful - hard enough returning to work, sorting childcare etc. without all this stuff.

Are you currently on maternity leave, and do the issues relate to your performance prior to your maternity leave? If so - and especially if the issues are only now being brought to your attention -then they are treading on dodgy ground in terms of sex discrimination.

I used to work in HR in performance management. It is not good practice for managers to bring up old incidences of "poor performance" - these things should be dealt with in a timely way, not a long time afterwards. Your manager shouldn't be telling you stuff about the performance of the person covering your role. Also, appraisals etc. should really be done early when women are going on maternity leave, not delayed until the return to work, otherwise it is difficult for everyone concerned to recall the relevant time period and assess performance properly.

Perhaps it'd be useful to think back to your time at work or look through old emails etc. (or anything else that'll remind you of that time) and make notes of your main achievements, positive things about your performance, your key skills etc. For your own benefit (confidence-boosting!) and the appraisal interview.

If when it comes to your formal appraisal you don't feel that her assessment of your performance is fair, your organisation should have a process to resolve this.

It might be worth speaking to ACAS and / or CAB for advice and keeping notes on the various conversations you have had with the manager, just in case things get ugly (really hope they don't).

[OliviaDee]

hi rydalema,

just to say i'm thinking about you. That sounds horrible and i hope it gets resolved soon.

stay well xoxo

[ryedalema]

Thanks for all your kind words - it makes me feel much better that others think she's out of order too.

Ruth - I'm in communications so sadly judgement/confidence are a big deal (same as any job I know ;-))

Kristy - your pm didn't come through (and so sorry you've had a sh!te time too), but don't stress, I know you have your hands full right now. Btw, that's the first time of Quincy - why do horrid illnesses have such cute names??

Smiler - yes I'm on mat leave and these incidences happened while I was pregnant and looking after a toddler by myself (OH working in Birmingham). Sadly - my boss's boss is the CEO, whom I'm not allowed to approach direct (he's not a mummy lover anyway so I wouldn't expect much sympathy there).

Olivia - thanks ;-)

Any other thoughts - my husband thinks she's b**lying me (sorry i know it's not swearing but I don't like the word).

Sex discrimination? Could that be the case when she's a she too?

Sadly no union, but we have an internal union of sorts - they are pretty toothless (as it were) though, and I'm not sure they'd stand up for me with these senior peeps.

[Fuschia]

I don't think that's a very appropriate use of KIT days. What an awful thing to have hanging over you when you are about to go back.

I do think if you could put any bad temper/forgetfulness/tiredness etc prior to your mat leave down as pregnancy related then you could argue discrimination if it affects your appraisal.. difficult though without a union on your side.

What effect would a poor appraisal have on you, practically? Perfromance related pay? Or is it just the upset?

[Fuschia]

A few relevant bits here I think, maybe:

http://www.i-resign.com/UK/discussion/new_topic.asp?t=8946

[littleEDfamily]

Like smiler, my profession is HR, and I tended to get involved in a lot of employee relations type stuff (from the 'other' side).

On the plus side, you are essentially a 'protected species' while pregnant and on maternity leave, but equally in your 'return to work' phase. Your employer has a legal responsibility to take a reasonable view, and make appropriate adjustments to take account of particular challenges you might face at work that are directly or indirectly related to your maternity.

There are several aspects of your treatment that concern me:

1. The fact that they are bringing up alleged instances of poor performance in the context of a return to work. These should have been dealt with at the time, and ideally addressed in a performance appraisal before you went on leave - effectively wrapping things up. In practice, these appraisals often don't happen, and in the employer's favour, often with reasonable justification as the maternity leaver starts to mentally 'check out', and it just doesn't seem appropraite to do it then.

2. I'm not convinced your KIT days are an appropriate time to make ominous comments about forthcoming (poor) appraisals. The focus should be on keeping you abreast of any changes to the org that have happenened while you have been off and giving you an opportunity to understand more about the role you are coming back to and expectations relating to it. On that last aspect (expectations relating to your role), there may be some justification for her to diplomatically and gently reference past issues, but this should be a supportive, constructive manner - not threatening.

From what I have read so far, I think you would have a reasonably good case for a bullying grievance. BUT!! Once you go down that road, in my opinion, there is no going back to a happy, productive working relationship with your boss. It's a one way ticket to you either resigning if the stress gets too much or some sort of pay off (which not all organisations are prepared to do even when they are clearly at fault).

So, assuming that approach is not for you, I think your only option is to take it on the chin (even the unfair bits), steel yourself to this not-very-nice-sounding woman and prove them wrong (easier said than done, I know, esp as it's a massive adjustment to go back to work, even where your employer is supportive). If that doesn't work, you can always then reexplore the need to raise a formal grievance, and in the meantime, keep very good records of exactly what has been going on.

I hope that it helpful. My post has come out quite harsh, but I do really empathise. This nasty stuff goes on all the time, in spite of all the legislation.

[Fidgetsmum]

It's easy to think that returning to your old place of work is your only option as you (I guess) will be seeking part time? Although the job market it very challenging at the moment, you may find it easier to deal with the bullying (and that is was I think it is) if you knew that there was a get-out clause of some sort. If I was you I would think of all the contacts you know in the industry and call (NOT email) those you can have a confidential conversation with about 'the market' - nothing more specific so that it can't get you into trouble if they do contact your boss for any reason - but have enough of a conversation to get to grips with any current vacancies in other companies or potential spaces/big projects coming up. You'll be surprised that with enough time spent contacting people in this way, you'll actually get a really good picture of what's around. If the answer is 'nothing', then at least you know, and that will help you knuckle down and prove your boss wrong.

But, if there is a twinkling of something else, then you can set your own boundaries and when the time is right for you, hand in your notice.

Finally, be positive about what you can bring, not what your negatives are. We all have negatives and some of us have had bosses that have focused on them, but if you focus on the positives, you give your boss a much harder time and eventually, she'll find someone else to pick on.

Just my opinion.

[ryedalema]

Wow - thanks for all of this. I will def. look at the job market (never stopped actually ;-)) and I think i will just 'suck it up' and prove them all wrong.

My current mantra is (and sorry for the cheese!) 'a job is for now...a family is for ever'.

xxxxx

[Smiler]

That is a lovely mantra!

[Ko]

poor you! can't offer much advice, but your boss sounds like a real cow. i hope you manage to sort it out xxx

[Belle]

hey - what kind of comms? PM me if you like - that was my area before I gave it all up for a life of drudgery ;-) - just thinking it's always good to get ideas from others in the same field if you're looking to move, and if I hear of anything that might suit you I could let you know. Not saying you need to go to those lengths but am a firm believer in looking around even when you're not looking if that makes sense. I'm about to start doing a bit of freelance so will be back in touch with various people and can keep ear to the ground if helpful.

I have to say (without knowing the formal HR rules) I think your manager sounds like she's breaking various protocols and also just shooting herself in the foot a bit by making you so wary of going back. My understanding has always been that complaints about conduct must be specific and timely (so 'you said XX to YY on such and such a date and it was considered to be inappropriate' or whatever) so she's really not handling it well. Perhaps it would be worth a chat ahead of going back where you ask some pretty direct questions to see how far she's planning to go? Could it be that she is just trying to keep you on your toes (completely unreasonable but just guessing as know some types could do this?). Massive sympathies whatever the case, so not what you need ahead of going back which I imagine has its own inherent stresses anyway.

[hpsaucey]

HI there. Lots of good advice already posted. I'm a union Health and Safety rep so get to see cases of harrassment/ bullying etc. If you haven't already done so its a good idea to start keeping a diary of comments etc and, if anyone has witnessed any of these comments, then try and get some sort of email comment from them if they're willing (I know someone already mentioned checking back on old emails etc).

I feel they have duty to clarify these 'incidences' they are mentioning because, if they are allegedly impacting on your performance, then your managers should be in the business of helping you improve your performance in a supportive way. Hopefully you'll find they are those incidences you mentioned - i.e. related to your pregnancy . Telling you than you face "a very challenging time when I return to work" is abrupt and totally lacking judgement on her part! Please write her comments down somewhere! Do you have an HR department or a sympathetic HR contact? I realise you may not want to 'escalate' things at this point by making anything more formal but forewarned is forearmed so it might be worthwhile having some sort of formal record if youo disagree with their assessment of your performance/they refuse to tell you what instances they are referring to.

Good luck!!

Helen

[ClareC]

Just wanted to add that I am so sorry this is happening to you. There is some good advice above which I won't repeat, suffice to say your boss clearly has performance issues with her management skills ( or rather lack of them).Appraisals are not a vehicle to raise a collection of gripes!! Any alleged issues with performance should be dealt with as and when they occur!!

Sounds very much like bullying, I have in the passed had a boss that was a bully and know how awful it is and the negative effect it has. Definitely keep a record and if the job is one you would like to change anyway consider raising a grievance for bullying, chuck in some sexual discrimination too, that always makes them take things seriously!! Good luck x

[Polly D]

She absolutely has to give you details of who apparently said what. And to tell you to never contact your CEO directly again? Sounds really quite unprofessional. The comment about your 'replacement' would have finished me off. She's making it very difficult for you to feel confident about your return to work.

I'm sure she can't get away with saying 'If I wanted you to leave, I'd have asked you'. It just doesn't work like that.

Can you speak to your HR department? I found mine reassuring when there was an issue I wasn't very happy about re my return to work.

Good luck

x

[ryedalema]

;-) thanks for these...you've some really good tips which I'm going to follow up this afternoon. The only problem about talking to my HR department is that she's the Director for that too, and stays at the Head's house so they are very close.

Ughhh - any tips for getting around that? I sure feel a bit 'where do I go for support?' internally.

[ClareC]

HR should be professional about it, maybe have an off the record informal and confidential chat with HR.

[Smiler]

Sounds like HR might be best avoided for now (if your nasty boss is the head of HR). But there is lots of support available from outside, this forum for example!

[littleEDfamily]

It does depend on the company, but I think in general, people are wrong in thinking HR is inclined to be sympathetic and helpful to the employee. Although on a personal level, we often side with the individual, we are paid by the company to manage their people risk. Yes, the organisation may have an expectation that we keep things fair and can help them to strive for 'best practices', and that we can be called upon to 'referee' where needed, but the bottom line is that HR is there to serve the company's best interests.

Therefore, many HR people will not consent to have an 'off the record' chat, as they are going to be unwilling to offer any advice that will compromise the company or undermine the manager. Also, in most instances it is necessary for the chat to be 'on the record' in order to resolve whatever issue has arisen.

HR will normally seem professional about it, and can be very useful in helping to address particular issues - just don't necessarily expect them to be on your side!

PS. Obv my thoughts about are not relevant to ryedalemama's sitch, as there is no 'separate' HR dept. Just feel it is my duty to debunk some of the myths about HR being 'nice'!

[Fuschia]

I think HR can be a bit of a brake on individual managers who aren't aware of policies or are risking an industrial tribunal or something...

[ryedalema]

Hi all - I'm still having sleepless nights about this (sigh) and expect it'll get worse before it gets better. One thought occurred to me last night - do I have to have an appraisal at all given that 3/4 of the year being appraised I was pregnant? I think my HR business partner suggested that I could just be scored as average and not actually have to go through the process.

I'd really welcome your advice xxx

Oh - and good morning everyone!

[littleEDfamily]

Morning - yes, as far as I know there is no way of getting out of being appraised while pregnant (but as already mentioned it should have happened at the time). The appraisal should however take account of your being pregnant - in general, it is risky to grade someone who was pregnant as 'below average' or 'poor', even if those ratings would have been justified for another employee - to do so safely, the company would be able to prove that the shortcomings were not in any way related to you being pregnant, which is all but impossible to do.

Can you use another KIT day and get this appraisal over with?

[Polly D]

Hmmmmmm, I do think you're being treated unfairly re your return to work but isn't expecting not to have an appraisal when pregnant asking for trouble? We can't expect to be treated the same if we don't want to be.