2 questions - b/f weaning and NAPS!

[snowboarder]

Sorry one post with 2 questions....off on hols and panicking....!!

1. - Naughty babysb seems to be weaning himself off breastfeeding at 14 months. Fine - pleased about that - he now only has a minute or two in the morning and maybe 5-10 before bed, he stopped all other feeds by himself (cried when offered!). But he won't drink cows milk at all bar maybe a few sips. If he stops b/f all together is it ok to not have ANY milk??

2. - I think we are moving towards dropping the morning nap - not so much in that he won't go down for his 9am sleep, but that if he sleeps in the morning it takes ages to go to sleep for 2pm nap and I end up waking him at about 3.30, and again takes ages at bedtime. Any tips on how to make the transition from 1 - 2 naps? Go cold turkey? Make the morning nap v short (ut then poss v grumpy at being woken before sleep cycle finishes)? I can see us having a stupid mid morning nap and then being v tired in the evening - and it upsets 12.30 lunch timing!! Tsk and just as we're off for 2 weeks. Also - he's only been napping in his cot for the last could of months and now won't sleep in his buggy! Argh!

Help....thank you!!!

[Moos]

First, have a great holiday and hope you get a chance to relax and kick back. You may find you have more energy once your body has recovered from breastfeeding, hurrah.

My take fwiw:

- I think babies are still supposed to have lots of milk at 14 months. Maybe keep trying with the milk, and at the same time fill up on the calcium with lots of cheese, yoghurt, smoothies, etc. Perhaps try soy milk?

- I'd drop the 9 nap completely and then pull the lunchtime nap forward a bit until he's fully transitioned and then can go back to his normal nap time.

Good luck!

[ludoscotts]

hi with the milk thing try expressing milk and mixing with cows milk. I had to give up breast feeding at 4 months due to some problems and out little one was on formula and she wouldnt switch to cows milk so in the end I weaned over a week by doing 6oz formula 1 oz cows, 2nd night 5 oz formula and 2 oz cows and so on until it was all cows milk worked a treat.

if he dosent want milk though I wouldnt worry our little one went through a stage (cant remember how old she was) but she refused all milk for about 2 weeks and I worried but health visitor said not to worry just make sure you get pleanty of calcium into them. and its surprising how much calcium in in things, so lots of fromage frais, raisins! cheese, calcium enritched orange juice, bread etc. I prob went overboard and found out how many mg's of calcium they needed per day and then wrote down how much she had had from what foods(printed a list off internet) but after a week she had had over the daily amount needed just from her normal food without me trying to up her calcium intake so I stopped worrying.

fingers crossed its all sorted soon

cant comment on naps as my little one never seemed to nap in the same way the other kids were doing!

[GinaG3]

Hey snowboarder,

He still should be getting rather a lot of calcium - Products containing calcium at this age have such a good nutritional value. Maybe keep trying a no pressure approach to offering whole milk - might it be the cup, have you tried offering different cups? Does he like cheese, yogurt? Don't forget calcium comes in many forms, even if your child had yogurt based fruit smoothies, cheese etc. this will definitely start to add up towards the amount of dairy needed in his diet. Good luck with it, I find my daughter still breastfeeding at 17 months but very fussy with whole milk (she will not drink it, unless she sees us drinking it then she wants some too, typical if you ask me)

BTW - With the sleeping and napping, i'm sure it will all be fine. If he is that tired he should sleep anywhere, regardless. The transition period from 2 - 1 naps can be a hard time. when my daughter was doing 2 naps a day, possibly 10-11 and 2-3 I didn't even notice the transition to only one, I just figured I'd let her get on with it. Now she will have one nap between 2-4 (I find this a bit late as then she wont go to bed till maybe 11-12pm, but we have a horrible pattern emerging wake up - 4 hours till nap - 2 hour nap - then 7 hours till bedtime). I do try to get her to have her one nap at maybe 1-2, then when she wakes up hungry, I can do her lunch. Try not too worry too much, it can be hard getting them to fall into a new pattern with naps etc. If you can wake him without making hi =m moody (some can) maybe try that, or keep him distracted as much as possible until you think its nap time then relax with him and get him off to sleep. You maybe find midday to be the perfect time then maybe he will be wanting to head for bed around 7-8. Sounds like a dream to me - ho hum!

Good luck, and have a nice holiday..

[marscapone]

My two have always been really random with nap times and have napped when they wanted. But when my son went from one nap to no nap I found that he needed a nap every second day until he got used to it. Don't know if this would work for you?

[randomv]

Hi

Lots of good advice already, but FWIW

1) I wouldn't worry about the milk. You can't make him drink it and as long as you supplement with plenty of dairy in his meals/snacks he should be fine. My friend's son was weaned from bf at a year and he resolutely refused to drink any sort of milk (cows, goats, formula etc) In fact he'd been a bottle refuser since birth. Anyway he is now a very happy, healthy and BIG strapping 4 year old whose had no ill effects. He just doesn't like milk!!

2) When my LO dropped the morning nap I started by giving him a very early lunch, then an early nap for 2 hours, say 11.45 and then an early bedtime (6.30) so that he wasn't too overtired. I gradually moved the lunch, nap and bedtime on by 15 mins a day over about 5 days til we got back to normal. Even so, he was very tired late morning for quite a while, and lunch never got past 11.30am for AGES or he was too tired to eat. If we were out in buggy or car late morning he would always fall asleep. I just let him have a 5-10 min catnap and put him down a bit later for his nap when that happened.

HTH and happy holidays!

[Fuschia]

Mine started to nap at about 11am... I struggled to fit lunch in before that, now they have a big snack (or rarely, lunch) by 12 and like to nap from about 12.15

I think having an warly 11am lunch for a while then nap (and avoiding car/buggy trips during the previous morning nap time) will help him transition

[The Nappy Lady]

Hiya,

Much like RandomV,

O would never drink Cows Milk, so I just made sure she got loads of cheesy sauces, yoghurts, semolina puddings etc. etc. you can smuggle a lot of milk into them under the guise of other food! Now she is 6 she has milk on cereal, and sometimes asks for warm milk at bedtime, but I think it is just her way of getting in on being the baby of the family now and again!!

On the nap front - would try to keep him going as long as possible, but if he goes down any time from 11am onwards for a couple of hours that should work fine, and you may find it slowly moves back later all on it's own - so for us it went from 11am ish back to 12, and now going down regularly between 12 and 12.30pm for 2 to 2.5 hours (usually have to wake her). The transition can be tricky, the worst is if they do a short lunch time nap, then want to sleep again around 4pm which can cause havoc with bedtime, but I find if you can give them a really busy stimulating morning it works wonders. Whilst away though I'd try to just go with the flow as he is going to be a bit thrown by being away from home. If you are going to be in a pool a lot swimming etc. you may find the 2 naps a day return to normal as he should be tired with all the swimming and excitement (that's what we found anyway).

Enjoy.

M

xx

(edited due to typo).

[snowboarder]

Thanks all - Maybe I should research calcium intake...but who knows how much he gets from me anyway? In some ways it's not so much that he won't drink cows milk, it's that he doesn't really ever drink anything in any quantity - water he just sips a lot. Doesn't love smoothies. Yoghurt under protest and only from squeezy tube (hates spoons!).

Will try and go with the flow on naps while away. To those on one nap a day - seriously - how do you manage on days out? Do they just have a shorter sleep and make do?

Off to pack!

[Bishberro]

Hi - already lots of good advice offered but what worked for us and cows milk was warming it up in the microwave a little bit as he wouldn't take it straight from the fridge. Not ideal if you're out and about but my son at 2 still likes his milk warmed and if we're out he just makes do with it at room temperature. It definitely worked at first though when he first took the beaker of milk around 12 months.

With naps, I also had the same problem. I ended up cutting out the nap in the morning, bringing lunch forward to midday, even 11.30am if he's exhausted then putting him down for a two-hour sleep around 12.30pm/1pm which he still has. As they get older they just seem to be able to keep going although my son still gets knackered around 10.30/11am and I reckon would sleep if I let him. Not sure if that's any help.

[randomv]

snowboarder Wrote:

> To those on one nap a day - seriously - how do you

> manage on days out? Do they just have a shorter

> sleep and make do?

>

Pretty much, yes! Occasionally he'll sleep for 1.5 hours in the buggy or car but more often than not it's 45 mins. I just put him to bed at 6.30pm so he doesn't get too overtired and I try my best not to have two consecutive days like this as I find the overtiredness is cumulative (and in the case of my LO leads to screaming at bedtime and a very early start the next day :-S)

I'd definitely go with the flow over your holiday though and just decide how you want to go about things when you get back.

Have fun (jealous!!)

[crystal7]

Snowboarder E weaned herself at about the same age and only started to drink milk from a cup once she'd completely stopped breastfeeding. I also use an Avent magic cup with a soft spout and warm the milk. Having said that E still only has about 100ml before bed an a few sips in the morning. As others have said just make sure he's getting yoghurt, milk, cheese etc.

I think (hope) we are making the transition to 1 nap (at 16 months!) think I might try some of the advice here although it sounds like it will be difficult to get out in the morning until transition is complete!

[Fuschia]

SB: on days out usually I leave at about 11.. so they can sleep then and later don't come home till 6ish (put them in pjs in car then straight into bed)

or leave early and they have two naps those days (they always sleep in the car) but can then be awkward with bedtime

[The Nappy Lady]

I'm a bit of a wimp and tend to avoid entire days out at the moment unless essential, in some ways it is a pain, but I know it will only be for a while, and I always feel we are all at our best when we are roughly sticking to the routine. If we go out in the morning I try to make sure we will be home before she nods off, though if it is a short journey home and she goes to sleep in the car or buggy I can almost always transfer her without any problems (touches wood at this point).

I don't stress too much about her having lunch before her nap - try to have snacks with me if running late, and if we get home and she's clearly bushed no point trying to make her eat because she's past it. I find she still sleeps fine and will happily have a light snack when she wakes and then have a really good tea.

The big sleep does cut the day in half horribly, and in the week with the school run to factor in as well ....well you can imagine, we have a window of opportunity from 9-12 and then 2-3.30 and that is it really.

Big days out - we either take the buggy or the sling, she will sleep in either, but generally only for an hour, rather than the usual 2 hours + at home, and I really value that time when at home too!

As F said, if going somewhere further afield I will often leave late morning so she sleeps in the car on the way, doesn't always work, but from 11am onwards there's a 75% chance it will.

Oh - on holiday in Spain we put a sunlounger cushion down on the ground, with a towel on it in the shade and she sleeps on that with a muslin over her - easy to move the cushion if the shade moves, and more comfortable (I think) than being strapped into a buggy. Could do the same thing with an inflatable lilo and a towel if you don't want to leave the pool maybe?

I kind of love and hate the lunch time nap, I know I will miss it when it's gone, but then again I feel as if we can start to have some big family days out again with both girls which will be great (without the need to lug buggys along and fret about whether she's slept for long enough etc).

I hate the fact I'm not more 'go with the flow' in the way some of my other friends are about all this, but I'm not and so I guess I've just got to accept it!

M

[snowboarder]

No, I'm not very go with the flow at all really, esp seeing how long it has taken to get him to sleep in his cot. I quite like the 2 naps - mean you get to have lunch out then come home for sleep if you want, and also not so much pressure to have one big sleep - so if morning nap is short can catch up with post lunch nap.

However if he keeps waking at 4.30am like last couple of days the morning nap is v needed....but then he chatted for an hour before going to sleep this evening! Honestly you just think things are settled...

[The Nappy Lady]

Ha! They are clever these babies - they don't want us to get bored, or worse yet complacent about this parenting lark!

[Pickle]

In terms of milk intake, I had the same problem with my son, who really seems to dislike milk (fair enough, so do I) and stopped accepting it as a drink at about 14 or 15 months. From memory I think they are still supposed to have the equivalent of a pint a day at that age.

I became an expert at getting him to have it through his food - thankfully he'll happily eat soup so a favourite for both of my kids is corn chowder (a couple of potatoes, onion, bay leaf, can of sweetcorn and lots of milk, then blend once everything is soft). I also make cheese sauce, and he's happy to eat yoghurts.

[Moos]

SB, if it's any comfort Moosling (who from early age like babysb only napped in buggy for v. short time then after agonising long sleep training started to nap in cot) from the age of just turned 2 was able to drop his lunchtime nap if he really needed to, in exchange for an early night. We too are rather glued to home at nap-time, though we've managed the occasional all-day outing with the help of the buggy (strap in, walk round for 15 minutes, gently lower snoring child to flat position, pop in shade and sprint for the picnic basket). But one big sleep can be flexible too - for us it can be any time between 1 and 2.30 to settle, and can be as short as 1 hour or even occasionally 2.5 hours.

[alieh]

snowboarder, we had the same with the 4-5 am wakings around the time he was transitioning to one nap. I think those early starts can be a sign that you need to get a tough with the AM nap! We had trouble pushing him to 11 or 11:30 at first, so I did a short nap in the buggy and woke him (easier than buggy than cot). Say 9:30-10:00, and I would plan to be at the park or a group so that I could wake him up and get him straight into doing something fun. Then he would normally be ready to go down again around 1:00, and I could let him sleep until 2:30 or 3:00.

We did this for a while, then started waking him after only 20 mins in the AM, then started having a few days where we could push him to 11:00 or 11:30, then alternated 2 nap and 1 nap days for a while, now he is fully on 1 nap. Though we find we can still do days out and he will either have a couple of short sleeps in the buggy, or a shorter sleep at lunch in the buggy. As long as I compensate for bad naps with a super early bedtime, he seems fine with it.

We had the same with cow's milk at first. It took a couple of months for him to start liking it. Eventually I found that if I warmed it (same as above) and also if I put it in a soft spout sippy cup, he would drink it more readily.

[Fi from West Dulwich]

Almonds very high in calcium (as are most nuts and seeds) so try stirring ground almonds in to porridge or any other such cereals you might give him. Would not recommend soy milk due to phytoestrogen content having potential to disrupt delicate hormone balance, especially in little boys. Equally I am not a big fan of cow's milk due to high allergic potential and poor ratio of other minerals like magnesium, also needed for bone strength, so if Baby SB is not keen, I wouldn't panic. Just fill his diet with healthy whole foods, and perhaps give him some calcium enriched oat milk, either in a bottle or again in porridge or equivalent. Oliver is obsessed with live natural yoghurt (sheep's is flavour of the day, and also less allergenic than cow's), which is nice way to get calcium, probiotics and a bit of protein down him.

More info on calcium content of foods here:

www.nnuh.nhs.uk/viewdoc.asp?ID=752&t=Leaflet

Hope this helps, F (nutritionist)

[caroline_green]

Hi there,

I know what you are going through. My DD (19 months) does not want to even go near cow milk and I felt not good about it first but since I know more about it is not an issue anymore.A lot of cultures do not drink milk at all, i. e. Japan and their society is one of the healthiest in the world. So there are plenty of other ways to make sure your baby gets enough calcium. Try yogurt or cheese it is a great source. Also broccoli, spinach and peas have plenty of it. Good luck and do not worry too much!

In releation to your second question..the amount of sleep needed by babies does vary a lot and changes all the time. Growth spurts and other things can influence it. Again, do not stress yourself too much and try to let him sleep when he wants to and not force anything.