The first ever size 16 girl to take part in the Miss England

[Gimme]

Is size 16 really 'normal' these days? Or is it just a common size since we all started getting fatter?

I'd have said that size 12 was a healthy size - not too fat, not too skinny. But if size 16 is normal then perhaps this is a sign of the times that we live in.

Studies seem to show that the fatter everyone gets, the more being overweight becomes acceptable.

The less people realise that they are medically overweight and the more acceptable people think being large is, the less incentive anyone has to try to become smaller even though it would be medically beneficial (although maybe the beneficial flip side to this is that there is also less pressure to diet put on young women).

[Narnia]

Would someone please explain to me what a size 16 means. 16 what and where? Why do sizes jump by 2? How can someone be a size zero?

Is this the same girl?

[sophiesofa]

Yes that's the same girl. She's very pretty but in my opinion no-one should be a size 16+ by her age. I think the national average is now a size 16 but for girls her age it's probably around a 10 (that's just my guess).

[sydenhamcentral]

It looks a bit like a reflection of someone in a spoon...

While I think celebrating real people rather than a stick thin model is good, celebrating someone who is clearly overweight is as bad. I think competitions like this are outdated. Why can't we celebrate things that are the best, most interesting or beautiful (I'm not talking about people). Growing up my heroes were people and groups like Joseph Paxton, the Beatles, Monty Python, Jimmie Stewart, I.K. Brunel, Picasso, Oscar Neirmeyer, Frank Lloyd Wright...

These days people seem to grow up wanting to be like Katie Price or Paris Hilton.

And that's just the blokes.

[MissM]

I think she looks awful - especially at the very badly fitted bikini top. Send her to the Bra Studio in forest hill!!

[RosieH]

Narnia Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Would someone please explain to me what a size 16

> means. 16 what and where? Why do sizes jump by 2?

> How can someone be a size zero?

> Is this the same girl?

Size sero is a complete red herring - it's an American size, equivalent to a size 4 over here. So for someone to talk about size 0 in the same sentence as size 16 being the British national average size isn't comparing like for like - just more media hysteria as zero sounds more extreme than "four".

[njc97]

Huguenot, genetics can also help your body decide how many calories it needs to eat, and the hunger reflex can be very, very strong. There is good evidence that no amount of exercise regimes/calorie counting can change your body weight by more than about 10% for a sustained period.

I don't think Chloe is especially overweight but nor do I think she's especially pretty. And MissM is right - she certainly doesn't look good in an ill-fitting bikini.

[*Bob*]

I like this photo, from her website.

[pk]

njc97 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Huguenot, genetics can also help your body decide

> how many calories it needs to eat, and the hunger

> reflex can be very, very strong. There is good

> evidence that no amount of exercise

> regimes/calorie counting can change your body

> weight by more than about 10% for a sustained

> period.

exactly just as some people are taller and some shorter, some people are born to be fatter and some thinner (and some thin people think that they can eat what they want because they don't put on weight, and then they have a heart attack)

[giggirl]

Huguenot Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

>

> Fat people are fat because they overeat and don't

> get enough exercise.

>

Not true at all. There are all kinds of wild cards in there. I got fat through not eating enough. I've always had a small appetite an I seldom feel hungry. Weight started to pile on in my late 30s. Earlier this year I went on a special diet which meant I had to eat 5 times a day (which was a struggle). I lost 2 stone in 7 weeks and had to stop the diet because I was loosing my curves (which I am fond of) and getting too skinny. After I stopped the diet I quickly reverted to my old habits of not eating and, guess what, I gained weight. This week I've gone back to eating 5 times a day and I've lost about 3lbs (today is Thursday). I have an appointment with a specialist next week to see how I can balance things out going forwards. Oh, and I get plenty of exercise.

Completely untrue that fat people are fat because they overeat and don't get enough exercise.

[Lawrence]

Perpetual motion discovered in East Dulwich.

[woofmarkthedog]

Personally.....

I feel she's "way" underrated

I mean read her pearls of sexual wisdom & you can't go wrong

I'd let her ( you know ) anyday ....

W**F

[Huguenot]

I'm afraid that despite your convictions, it's chemistry: not old wives tales.

I'm not a fat Nazi, I'm just trying to explain the systems.

A 'calorie' is a unit of energy. You need energy to make your body work. It can be found in food as chemical energy, and can be stored in your body for easy access as chemical energy - as fat, or muscle or a few other ways.

We store energy as fat to get us through quiet times on the hunter gatherer circuit.

When you do anything - think, move, breathe - we turn this stored chemical energy into other forms: heat or movement. In other words you 'burn fat'. Being a heavy thinker can burn fat almost as quickly as having a jog. Your brain turns over and your head gets hot.

You cannot get fat unless you put the calories in. Unless you photosynthesise or ingest chemicals through your skin (both of which are technically plausible but unlikely) you cannot get fat without eating. Eating too many calories doesn't necessarily make you fat, but you can't get fat without eating too many calories.

That's it.

It is true that some people have more efficient digestive systems than others. Some people can eat loads and stay slim, some people take on calories quicker. However, the calories must be there in the first place.

Uptake of protein influences the way you process carbohydrates, so the mix of your diet can influence how quickly you get fat.

However, the simple fact is that you can only get fat through ingestion of calories.

You may think you stopped eating and still got fat. It's simply not what happened. Your memory is faulty (not necessarily in a bad way, I forget things all the time).

As for exercise, it burns chemical energy stored within your body. Dependent upon the type of exercise it may burn fat stores or other stored energy (such as muscle), or just blood sugars.

Either way the only source for these calories is food.

If you're fat you take in more calories than you need and don't burn them through exercise. Simple.

I appreciate that some people may eat compulsively. Other people do the same with drink, cigarettes or heroin.

If you make up stories about this you may justify yourself psychologically, but you're quite simply wrong.

[woofmarkthedog]

Here we go...

"Ding ding....seconds out"

( which in it's self burns calories )

W**F

*checks profile in mirror & deffo slimmer by a glimmer*

[Gimme]

You sound like gold dust to the diet industry giggirl. Wish I could eat more and lose weight!!!

giggirl Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Huguenot Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> >

> > Fat people are fat because they overeat and

> don't

> > get enough exercise.

> >

>

> Not true at all. There are all kinds of wild

> cards in there. I got fat through not eating

> enough. I've always had a small appetite an I

> seldom feel hungry. Weight started to pile on in

> my late 30s. Earlier this year I went on a

> special diet which meant I had to eat 5 times a

> day (which was a struggle). I lost 2 stone in 7

> weeks and had to stop the diet because I was

> loosing my curves (which I am fond of) and getting

> too skinny. After I stopped the diet I quickly

> reverted to my old habits of not eating and, guess

> what, I gained weight. This week I've gone back

> to eating 5 times a day and I've lost about 3lbs

> (today is Thursday). I have an appointment with a

> specialist next week to see how I can balance

> things out going forwards. Oh, and I get plenty

> of exercise.

>

> Completely untrue that fat people are fat because

> they overeat and don't get enough exercise.

[giggirl]

Huguenot you are a patronising, unbearably smug, self-satisfied twat pontificating about something you know nothing about. Where do you get off calling my experiences "old wives tales"? You're a fucking clown. Not everyone falls into your one size fits all theory that you've mentally downloaded from some men's magazine. And, for the record, unlike yours, my memory is not faulty. One of the things that you seem to have forgotten is that you have no medical or scientific qualifications.

Fact - up to a few months ago I was existing on a diet of 800 - 1000 calories a day maximum. I have done for years. Very small appetite - no real interest in food. Some days I would eat even less.

Fact - by increasing my calorific intake and eating 5 times a day I lost 2st in 7 weeks.

You may call this an old wives tale but it is FACT - 2 stone - gone. 2 dress sizes - gone.

In your super-smug words Huguenot "If you make up stories about this you may justify yourself psychologically, but you're quite simply wrong."

Err - not really something I can make up stories about really because I'm eating more and I'm 2 stone lighter and that is self-evident.

Just to indulge you and your one size fits all theory for one moment: "If you're fat you take in more calories than you need and don't burn them through exercise. Simple.". So, if I was listening to you I would need to reduce my meagre 800 - 1000 calories a day even further in order to loose weight? Not only would this be a really dangerous thing to do but it would also cause the body to go into starvation mode. If you don't know what body starvation mode is then google it because, unlike you, I'm not going to sound off like I am an expert.

I suspect that because I had under-eaten for so many years I had somehow damaged the way my body metabolised food and stored fat. I also suspect that there are quite a lot of other people in the same boat. People likely to be in their 30s and 40s. Sadly, for anyone like me, there are a lot of self-proclaimed experts out there ever-ready with their dud advice, which is just a slap in the face.

Right now I am at the ideal weight for my height. To maintain that weight I need to keep eating at present levels (i.e. 5 times a day) and not revert to 800 - 1000 calories a day, missing meals and sporadic eating. For me, that's hard.

Huguenot - the human body is a more complex machine than you seem to be able to grasp. You are not an expert. When somebody tells you that their experience is different try, very hard, not to patronise the fuck out of them.

[Jeremy]

http://upnextinsports.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/sports-pictures-james-oneal-go-girl.jpg

[Narnia]

GG,I'd be interested in knowing what your 5 times a day diet consists of if you'd care to share it. Also how much exercise you do.

[Cassius]

800-1000 calories sounds very low to me - do you think that your body was already in starvation mode which is why you couldn't lose weight when you were eating at that rate, then when you started to eat more you kick started your metabolic system into play again so you lost weight because your body was metabolising food at this new faster rate. Just one thought.

[giggirl]

Cassius Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> 800-1000 calories sounds very low to me - do you

> think that your body was already in starvation

> mode which is why you couldn't lose weight when

> you were eating at that rate, then when you

> started to eat more you kick started your

> metabolic system into play again so you lost

> weight because your body was metabolising food at

> this new faster rate. Just one thought.

Yes

[giggirl]

Narnia Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> GG,I'd be interested in knowing what your 5 times

> a day diet consists of if you'd care to share it.

> Also how much exercise you do.

This is an average day but it varies.

Breakfast is carbohydrate in some form - so either Oatmeal with water or a cereal bar or toast

Mid morning - a protein bar or shake

Lunch - the main meal of the day. Chicken or fish with a huge salad. I work so I usually get take out from somewhere like Eat or M&S. Or a big plate of sushi with a salad eaten separately.

Mid afternoon - another protein shake plus some fruit.

Evening - a big portion of steamed vegatables covered in olive oil. This is my favourite meal of the day and I love steamed vegetables.

In addition, I drink a lot of water and take supplements. I drink black coffee and alcohol in moderation. In the 7 weeks that I lost the 2 stone I didn't drink any alcohol at all.

Exercise - this is more complicated. I used to exercise a lot but I made a decision in January to give up my membership to ESPA on Lordship Lane. I just wasn't enjoying it and it felt rather lonely. I'm time-poor and I decided that I only wanted to do exercise that was sociable and/or that I enjoyed. So now I have a few DVDs that I do at home 4-5 days a week for about 20 minutes a go. When the ED swimming pool re-opens I'll go there as I enjoy swimming. Tomorrow I'm going on an all-day Salsa course in Clapham, which I bought for a friend for her birthday but it's something I want to do too. Basically, that would be a fun way to keep fit if it works out. I'm sort of done with pounding on machines at the gym - I know it's good for you but it's lonely.

[Huguenot]

You didn't read my post giggirl, and calling me names doesn't change the facts.

I didn't say that eating more would make you gain weight.

In fact I'll even quote my post so we're all clear: "Eating too many calories doesn't necessarily make you fat, but you can't get fat without eating too many calories."

Neither at any point did I recommend that you should eat less. You made that bit up.

It is entirely possible that you put your body into famine mode with your ridiculous diet. In doing so you increased the efficiency of your digestive system. Let's quote me again: "It is true that some people have more efficient digestive systems than others."

It simply meant that you were taking more calories out of the food you ingested, rather than letting it pass through you. Either way, there's no way you could ingest 800 calories a day over a sustained period and get fat unless you were burning fewer than 800. Were you perhaps lethargic and sluggish?

I also pointed out that there are secondary dietary issues that could influence calorie uptake. Here's me again with an example: "Uptake of protein influences the way you process carbohydrates, so the mix of your diet can influence how quickly you get fat."

I think you'll agree that those points allow for the condition you put yourself in, despite your somewhat hypersensitive and perhaps overhasty response.

I suspect that in your self-indulgent foam flecked delirium you've identified some personal slight that simply didn't exist.

Getting fat is what happens when your body ingests more calories than it consumes. You cannot do this unless the calories are there in the first place.

It really is simple giggirl. I've read both of my posts on this, and there doesn't see to be anything more I need to say.

You are of course perfectly entitled to go off on one again over some perceived slight, but forgive me if I politely ignore you ;-)

[giggirl]

You're a patronising areshole Hugenot. You're not clever; you're not even knowledgeable; you're just self-opinionated.

[Huguenot]

Just to illustrate the point isn't just uneducated and mine alone, this is from the British Medical Journal:

"Obesity exhibits both genetic and familial associations, suggesting an element of individual susceptibility that interacts with adverse environmental conditions to cause extreme weight gain.

"There has been a tendency for aetiological research to focus on possible metabolic defects which might explain why particular individuals are unable to regulate energy balance. For instance, in the 1970s the perception that obese people ate less than their lean counterpart triggered massive research investment into an abortive search for an energy sparing defect - the "Doctor, it's my metabolism" syndrome.

"Such investigations have now largely been abandoned since it is clear that obese people tend to provide biased diet records and habitually eat far more than they claim, thus eliminating the initial basis of the hypothesis. Many similar investigative trails could be cited. This emphasis on research into metabolic susceptibility persists and was exemplified most recently by intense public interest in a genetic cause for obesity following the sequencing of an "obesity gene" from ob/ob mice."

In other words, fat people tell tall stories about their diet.

[Huguenot]

I should add that the article only states a tendency, and in no way implies that giggirl is mistaken regarding her diet.

It's seems entirely plausible that there are people out there who are a living refutation of the first law of thermodynamics.