Breast Feeding in shops

[mockney piers]

Currently I have a fat naked man sitting naked in his living room in the flat opposite, reading a paper oblivious to the disturbed occupants of the office outside his window. He's currently lying a third believe me!!

[Asset]

Is the woman sitting there with no top on and both breasts on show or is she sitting there quietly feeding her baby with a top on and one breast slightly exposed in order for said baby to get its gob round it?

[FatHappyChappy]

Sorry Sean and Mockney, I know it's rude to shout, I just got so excited (not aroused I hasten to add) to see Mrs P this morning. I couldn't help smiling at her thinking 'if only she knew what she has started'. I am calling her Mrs P from now on, as in Mrs Prescott (2 Jugs - geddit?). Have a nice day all, I am off to change my Birkenstocks in ED's. Mockney, could you get me a pic of the fat naked man, want to know whether he's actually fatter than me, it's not a 'gay' thing, well I least I don't think so, mmmmm, I could feel another thread coming on here.

[Keef]

Put this in the other thread.

"Did anyone see that thing about breast feeding on TV last night? Now I'm all for kids being breast fed up to and beyond 2. But 8, come on, that's just weird!"

For my part, I agree with Chav & TT, breast feeding is spot on, but I think some people could be more discreet about it...

A good friend works in one of the bars on LL, and has said to me he has felt uncomfortable in the past when a table of 3 women were taking it in turns to feed their sprogs with as little subtlety as possible. He felt like they were almost daring him to say something about it... Surely that is aggressive breast feeding, and not really necessary?

This next comment might get me shot down, but there you go.... I feel that sometimes these women are being so obvious about their breast feeding simply to show the world how succesful they've been at being an ED "yummy mummy", and that if the trendy thing to do was to bottle feed, their breasts would be back in their bras before you could say "blue mountain".

Not so long ago, breast feeding was looked at as very working class, and something for the poor and the hippies...

[Michael Palaeologus]

I have a lactating donkey that might help solve the problem.

[Michael Palaeologus]

Seriously, whats the problem with breasts anyway? We will soon be trotting off on holidays and those on European beaches will be surrounded by them.

Just because the breasts are on view in Nero or the Butchers and happen to be doing what they were designed to do it seems that moral outrage ensues.

If somebody is trying to make a point by very public breast feeding, well point proven I think.

[Jessie]

It makes me feel sad all these assumptions are being made about women just because they choose to breastfeed, like it's some kind of code to belong to some Yummy Mummy sect.

I breastfed my child because:

It's free!! I'm NOT a yummy mummy, I don't have lots of cash to spend on stuff I don't need, I need to watch the pounds.

It's the best thing for my child, the best thing for me. I have a huge history of breast cancer in my family. Breastfeeding is proven to reduce the risk in breast cancer.

It was a massively strong bond between me and my son and after a v traumatic pregnancy AND birth AND infancy, we needed all the help we could get with that one.

No need for tonnes of sterilising crap to cart half way round the world and back.

So so so many reasons why it's good to breastfeed, and luckily for me (and my son) I didn't give a sh*t what people thought about me breastfeeding.

[*Bob*]

This whole thread is pointlessly polarised.

No-one here has said breastfeeding is a bad thing, nor should breastfeeding Mums hide themselves (and their jubblies) away from the stares of the hoi polloi. Just that someone who (apparently) is making a point of 'being seen breastfeeding' - by as many people as possible - is perhaps being a bit of a tit.

Personally I couldn't give tinker's cuss!

[James]

I'm astonished at the way breastfeeding has been compared with defecating, urination, picking scabs and even masturbation on this thread. Um, hello? This is utterly ridiculous and demeaning to women who breastfeed in public. I do hope none who do are reading this and end up hiding away in some grotty loo to do it thanks to your ignorant, intolerant remarks. Breastfeeding is a form of EATING. If you have issues with it, it's your problem! You could always try looking away. There's a thought.

Incidentally if any women who breastfeed in public are reading this I would encourage you to continue and please ignore the stupid remarks on this forum, many I'm guessing from men who have a repressed fixations and Freudian issues with your boobs.

[Keef]

Exactly right. Nowhere did I say that people breastfeed to be yummy mummies.

EDIT: "Exactly right" was aimed at *Bob*'s post. James, I totally agree with you about breast feeding, but again, I don't think anyone on here has really said it's a bad thing... Also there have been a lot of p!ss take posts, that I don't think should be taken too seriously.

[Jessie]

Keef, not in so many words but it was what i inferred from:

"I feel that sometimes these women are being so obvious about their breast feeding simply to show the world how succesful they've been at being an ED "yummy mummy", and that if the trendy thing to do was to bottle feed, their breasts would be back in their bras before you could say "blue mountain"."

[*Bob*]

James,

As I think someone quite rightly pointed-out earlier in this thread: most men couldn't care less. It's women really seem to take offence.

[Domitianus]

Such interesting responses. I was inclined to agree with TillieT who struck an admirably balanced chord - it is something that people should be encouraged to do but should also perhaps exercise a degree of discretion about knowing that it is off-putting to some people in some situations.

Then we had James weigh-in with his claptrap about anyone who is not 100% in favour of overt, public breastfeeding being riddled with issues, repressions, fixations and Freudian cocnepts. Interesting! Anyone who is familiar with the history of Freudian thought itself will be aware that even amongst early psychoanaltic circles it was popular practice to make ad hominum attacks on other people's theories simply by accusing them of exactly these types of vague, nebulous, psychiatric defects. Indeed, with a few notable exceptions, the entire tone of the attacks on those who are not 100% in favour of BF'ing in public has been along the lines of "you are sexist, dinosaurs, repressed, anti-women, uncomfortable with naked breasts, fixated on tits, etc etc etc." Oh well, I guess that is the inevitable consequence of not being able to address the arguements and having to attack the person with allegations of various psychiatric instability despite not even knowing the person in question.

Then we had a couple of people who were "speechless". At least that is honest - they admitted they didn't have any arguement to make and were simply responding with knee-jerk reactions that they 'just knew' or 'just felt' that BF'ing is a good thing.

ear old James also notes of course that BF'ing is a form of "EATING". I will ignore the obvious point that it is actually drinking and assume that his underlying point is that this is a natural process and should be universally acceptable. Does this mean then that I could bring my dog into Cafe Nero and give him a tin of Winalot in a bowl? Whi, if eating is so unioversally acceptable, do we have signs on buses and tubes asking people not to eat take-away food on public transport as it may offend other people?

Let's look at another nice natural act - PERSONAL GROOMING! This is a great thing to do and I doubt anyone would want to be around someone who didn't pay attention to personal hygiene. Does this mean I would be entitled to sit in a restaurant or cafe and clip my finger or toes nails, or squeeze a spot in front of other diners? I imagine a great many people would find this an off-putting spectacle and ask me to do it somewhere more discrete. I could argue till I was blue in the face that it was a perfectly natural and necessary thing to do but many people would say "Perhaps, but not here thanks, I'm eating." Bottom line is there is at least a sizeable minority of people who find someone breast-feeding nearby something that is not necessarily conducive to a hearty appetite and I think it is perfectly reasonable that the feelings of those people should be taken into consideration and some balance be arrived at. It is easy, yet also childish and rather sad, to simply dismiss such people as "repressed" and "fixated".

Final point - I LOVE women's breasts, I have no hang-ups about them at all. I love to touch them, fondle them, stroke them, suck them and kiss them etc etc. I find that their appeal is slightly diminished in my eyes when a baby is attached to them and I am expected to have to sit and view this sight whilst eating or drinking. I am particularly irritated when this is done without any apparent consideration on the part of the mother in question for the fact that others might be put off victuals that they have paid to be able to consume in comfort.

Someo

[Keef]

Jessie Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Keef, not in so many words but it was what i

> inferred from:

>

> "I feel that sometimes these women are being so

> obvious about their breast feeding simply to show

> the world how succesful they've been at being an

> ED "yummy mummy", and that if the trendy thing to

> do was to bottle feed, their breasts would be back

> in their bras before you could say "blue

> mountain"."

What did you infer from

"For my part, I agree with Chav & TT, breast feeding is spot on, but I think some people could be more discreet about it..."

Sorry if I am misunderstood. I have NO problem with breast feeding. I think it is a very very good and important thing. I think women should feed their kids when and where they / the kid so chooses. However, I really don't think some women need to be quite as abvious about it. Other women have said on this thread that it can be done anywhere in a discreet manner.

I don't think that breast feeding makes you a yummy mummy, I was airing an opinion about a certain type of person, that is all.

I am sorry if that makes me a bit of a prude. I do suspect however that it's not only men who find it puts them off their beer sometimes though!

I can't believe I've been drawn in to this, I was only going to make a quick post then flee :-S

[Domitianus]

As an aside I am also inclined to think there may be SOME truth in the opinion 'expressed' (no pun intended) by someone that there is a degree of social cache and trendiness present here (NO, not in every case before I am further castigated!) Those who have read my earlier comments in this thread will have heard how I worked for a very feminist dominated organisation over ten years ago and was taken to task for suggesting that breast-feeding was a good thing that should be encouraged. I was told then that my views were a typical male's views, attempting to tie a woman to her child, happy to turn a woman into nothing but a breeding and feeding machine, denying her her right to a separate individual identity etc etc etc ad nauseum. When I pointed out that there was simply an overwhelming degree of evidence that suggested BF'ing was usually the healthiest option for both mother and child, I was told that I was simply trying to impose a guilt complex on those mothers who chose nopt to breast feed by insinuating that they were 'bad mothers'. It certainly seems that the prevailing fashion changes with the times and some people are so temperocentric that they are unable to appreciate how their views are shaped by current convention, which may well change.

Seems I am damned if I advocate BF'ing and damned if I ask people to be a little more considerate of others when carrying it out.

[Keef]

For some reason this subject came up at a family dinner a short while back, and my mum said that she'd fed both my sister and I, and part of the reason was simply that times were hard in those days, and it was cheap (well free). She said that some of the richer (I won't say posher, because my mum is actually very well brought up, she just isn't wealthy.... See, class is bo!!ocks) mothers would look down their noses at her because she wasn't bottle feeding.

Times do change..

As I've written that, I've realised that I have actually written the same story on this forum before, so this is all just a repeat. Lets close the thread there! ;-)

[Domitianus]

I am happy to close the thread. Bloody tiring fighting my corner! Has everything that needs to be said been said? Everyone insulted eachother adequately? All agreed to disagree?

[Jonboy]

Domitianus for President.

[James]

Whoops, drinking not eating. Obviously this completely negates my argument (not).

A few minor points to help you Domitianus:

1) A Baby is not a dog. A baby feeding in a restaurant is socially acceptable whereas a dog eating in a restaurant would be a different matter. Obviously.

2) Signs on public transport are because take-aways smell and litter is usually left. Breast feeding a baby causes neither of these issues.

3) Personal grooming. Again, like urinating etc. this is not comparable to feeding a baby. You have no need to do this in public whereas a mother may need to feed her baby during the day.

4) Freudian thing. Your remark about "loving women's breasts" gives you away. So because breasts are sexual objects for you, women mustn't perform their natural function in front of you as it might make you feel a bit funny. Sounds like your issues to me! Reminds me of those Islamic extremists who insist on women being veiled because a woman who isn't is like "uncovered meat" & they might get a bit excited.

You really need to get over yourself and try to empathise a bit more. The whole world doesn't revolve around you!

[mockney piers]

> "they admitted they didn't have any argument to make and were simply responding with knee-jerk reactions that they 'just

> knew' or 'just felt' that BF'ing is a good thing."

That's a bit cheeky Dom, I was just staggered that this subject could cause so much vitriol. Akin to arriving at the old people's home to see my (now ex) granny in the middle of a punch up about garden gnomes. I'd have been equally speechless, regardless on my personal feelings about whether they should or shouldn't fish in the garden pond.

[Keef]

James Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> 4) Freudian thing. Your remark about "loving

> women's breasts" gives you away. So because

> breasts are sexual objects for you, women mustn't

> perform their natural function in front of you as

> it might make you feel a bit funny. Sounds like

> your issues to me! Reminds me of those Islamic

> extremists who insist on women being veiled

> because a woman who isn't is like "uncovered meat"

> & they might get a bit excited.

Oh come on!!!

Where's the love?!?!?

[*Bob*]

i like tits too

[Jonboy]

Its good all this, a bit like the Oxford Union. No doubt we will see some of the debaters from here fasttrack their way into politics - they may even be head hunted by the major parties. Or not.

That said, I dont know anywhere else on a Monday afternoon that has such a good debate on breasts going on so fair play all round.

[Jah Lush]

Yeah, I like breasts too but it doesn't mean I have an oedipus complex and I can't see how a woman feeding her baby would be a turn on for anyone, like I said before it's the most natural thing in the world so why oh why get so uptight about it.

[Keef]

Heh heh heh heh you said Breasts (Done in Butthead voice)