Breast Milk STINKS...............apparently

[Pickle]

This is absolutely appalling, but great to see the response on here, and the fact that Mind have taken it seriously. We have had bad experiences in the shop previously when attempting to donate things, and from the description it is the same member of staff that we have dealt with.

In nearly 3 years (in total) of breastfeeding my 2 children I never had any negative response to it when in the East Dulwich area, and I was never one to hide away to feed. Very sad to hear that some feel uncomfortable in public, but agree with JDR that you shouldn't let it stop you. You've got as much right to BF in public as others have to bottle feed.

Well done Fatherjack for bringing this matter to the attention of the forum, and to everyone for the fantastic response.

[JDR]

Pickle - waht time is it where you are??? Hope you're havig a great time

[Pickle]

Lunchtime! We're 13 hours ahead of you. Having a lovely time in the sun, thanks :)

[mumof3girlies]

Firstly just want to say how horrible for you localmama to experience this horrible experience, I have breastfed all of my girls up to 18 months and thankfully have never had any negative comments when I have had to feed any of them in public and I have fed them in changing rooms - even M&S! What is the exact description of the member of staff? (it may have already been described in the thread but I may have missed it) I had a bit of a run-in in the shop about 5 years ago, my middle child was about 8 weeks old and in a sling, this member of staff was putting heavy books on a shelf above my head and a book fell down and literally missed my daughter's head by millimetres, I pointed this out to him and he just shrugged couldn't even manage an apology, I know the book didn't hit her but if it had it was pretty heavy and could have been quite dangerous. I phoned the local office to complain and they were alright but not very interested and suggested I put it in writing if I was still upset. The feeling I get is that as the staff may work there voluntarily they don't have to adhere to basic levels of courtesy and politeness, however even though they are voluntary they are still representatives for the charity and shouldn't be working there if they can't control rude and obnoxious behaviour towards members of the public. Even if this guy has got mental health difficulties, what you experienced was discrimination and just as bad as if a person with mental health difficulties was harassed/abused.

And by the way the staff in St christophers' hospice are always polite and kind, I have always slightly wary of the staff in the MIND shop, since my experience in there.

edited to say - it is him, I have just seen localmamas other thread, it's the man with shaved head and multiple piercings.

[ryedalema]

What a nice message from the CEO - and on a Saturday night - points for that in my book.

http://www.mhpf.org.uk/board.asp?member=PaulFarmer

I hope his words turn into actions, and that you can put this all behind you localmama.

FJ you are right - it is absolutely not acceptable for someone to 'peek' into the changing room. What an invasion of privacy.

Sounds like this guy has committed many crimes against acceptable behaviour. I have to say I've always found the other staff members to be really nice. I wonder what it's like to work for/with him then!

[localmama]

Here is the reply I received Sat just before 10pm (so cudos for working late!):

Thank you for your email. I am extremely concerned by your experiences in the East Dulwich shop and would like to offer my apologies for any offence you have been caused.

The Managing Director of our shops network is managed by Bob Monteath, and I have asked him to investigate your experience as soon as possible, and copied him into this email. He will be in touch in due course.

Best wishes

Paul Farmer

Chief Executive, Mind

Sent from my BlackBerry? wireless device

[localmama]

I also wanted to add that this is the first negative response I have ever received for breastfeeding in public (as in out of the house, since I was behind a curtain!) in the UK for either of my daughters. I've had a couple of people tell me I was doing a good thing and many think my baby is sleeping.

What would I like?

A public apology.

A clear policy allowing women to breastfeed in the change rooms.

A clear policy about privacy behind curtains (if they don't have one already!!!)

Training & monitoring for these policies.

Follow up with the manager so he never again

1-looks behind a closed curtain

2-makes women feel uncomfortable for feeding their babies

3-harasses and insults his customers (it seems there are a few people on the board that feel he has done this to them..)

Follow up with the area manager so he listens to the complaint being made and does not condone looking behind curtains.

[localmama]

People might also want to support this bill

(From the NCT campaigning website: http://www.nct.org.uk/active/network/nationalcampaigning/babyf )

Equality Bill

Background

The government has proposed a guarantee for all women across the UK of an explicit right to breastfeed in public places for the very first time in the Equality Bill which is currently going through Parliament. This will bring the rest of the UK in line with Scotland.

What we are doing

We are continuing to lobby MPs of all parties to support the Equality Bill.

Take Action: takes 5 minutes

Write to your MP and ask them to show their support for an Equality Bill which meets the needs of pregnant women and new parents.

[Fuschia]

After the same man was rude to me I don't take stuff in there anymore, I send Mr F in if necessary!

[joom]

How bizarre that the manager should behave like this when all charity shops have a not too pleasant smell about them!

[localmama]

About the possibility of the man having mental health issues.. even if this is the case, I still don't feel it's an excuse for the harassment I received. Good on Mind for supporting people to gain work experience, confidence, break isolation etc. At the same time, if their volunteers or employees are dealing with the public (many of whom have mental health issues of their own! government stats say 1 in 4 women is treated for depression..), they should be properly trained and supported so they don't insult their customers. I don't think that's an unreasonable request, especially at the management level!

[The Nappy Lady]

Thank you localmama, that's a good list that I totally agree with. Will put this into my email, I know he has responded now, but still want to lobby for these changes to be made.

Molly

[bee74]

This is appaling! I just don't understand how a society can antagonise women for doing something so natural. It should be encouraged and supported. In the last month, I've had two very different experiences.

In India, it was taken for granted that I'd still be breastfeeding my son (he is 14 months) and even the doctor asked how many times a day he was feeding , rather than ask if I was still feeding. Then we went to the doctor here (my son has had a persistent cough!) I started breastfeeding in the waiting room and they asked me to go into a separate room! At a GP!!!! We were then referred onto a pediatrician at King's who was shocked I was still breastfeeding and that I should really start weaning my toddler off the breast! I just could not believe.

This is very sad and upsetting and I think we really need to be more visible with our breastfeeding to make it more acceptable and ordinary.

[sillywoman]

Which pediatrician bee74? I really hope you made a formal complaint? Unless these outdated unsupported & indefensible beliefs are tackled head on they will continue to be allowed to cause distress to women and make some doubt themselves and their entirely correct instincts. There is no evidence whatsoever to support any suggestion that a 14 month old should be weaned. Grrrrr, that does make me cross (6)

[The Nappy Lady]

Bee74, that is outrageous. The World Health Organisation recommends BF to the age of 2, I am appalled by health professionals doing anything to discourage or undermine this.

I only had something similar once when feeding my 13 month old on the beach, and another Mum said "you're still breastfeeding her?" in a shocked way.....

Molly

[Belle]

I don't think legally they had a right to ask you to move - maybe someone else on here knows more? Def worth complaining to the practice.

[sillywoman]

A very dear friend had a similar experience with a paediatrician, can't recall if it was Kings or not, but they're not given any training in long term benefits of breastfeeding at all. It does seem as though some (by no means all though) of them allow their ill founded & uninformed personal prejudices to seep into their professional life, and then present them as a 'professional' opinion. Very undermining & dodgy.

[lorraineliyanage]

I was told to stop breastfeeding in the waiting room at Southwark Registry Office when I registered my daughter's birth when she was 5 weeks old. It was, apparently, making some man feel uncomfortable about coming into the waiting room. I was pointed in the direction of the toilets to go breastfeed which I just ignored, although apparently the toilet there does double as a feeding room. Eitherway, it seemed a bit unhygienic and I not something I was prepared to do!

[emc]

Hi All

I am interested in following up this story for the TV programme I work on...I have PMed local mama but in case she is not currently looking at EDF if anyone knows her pls could you pass on my number to her? It's 07958 583690.

Many thanks

Emma

[mumra]

Gosh, I would like to say I am surprised by the reaction of the man at MIND but am not, I too experienced some real ignorance when breastfeeding my child at the Tate modern ('please go at sit in the schoolroom with the teenage boys or in the toilet') and unfortunately this will always be an issue until politicians or large companies start to change practice and policies, and therefore the mindset of many. Unfortnately the man at MIND had probably never been given, or told specific guidance on breastfeeding mothers and was therefore reliant on his own misinformed opinion. Until companies start bringing out statements (similar to equality and harrassment statements) we will continue to rely on the opinion of a few who wil let down the very organisations who refuse to make a stand on this issue in the first place.

PS Found Science Museum/National Gallery/ Transport Museum/ John Lewis/ Cafe Nero in Lordship Lane to be more than accommodating!

[The Nappy Lady]

I just cannot believe any mother should have to think twice about this. I will feed my child as and when I need to, (if need be discretely, if situation demands it), but I refuse to treat it as something that should not be done in 'public'.

What is the issue here? Seeing a woman's breast? Possibly a glimpse of nipple? Seeing a baby feed?

Why is any of this shocking?

What is so awful about the human body?

It is as if certain people would put breast feeding in the same category as someone choosing to be a 'flasher', or worse.

It makes me so angry I cannot begin to tell you. Worse, I know I now sound like a vigilante, and I am so not. But a law does need to be brought in about this, and the sooner the better.

I really hope emc manages to make this into a piece, it needs to be highlighted again, and again, and again until it is resolved.

Molly

[busymum]

this is really shocking, thanks for letting us know.

also just read the thread from the Mum herself ('localmama' - Manager at Mind charity shop)

the guy in the charity shop is rude to everyone! but I shouldn't think he'll be there for much longer with all these complaints.

I have always breastfed in public and would have flipped if that happened to me!

[Belle]

As I thought, think it is illegal to stop someone bf in public - found this interesting thread on babycentre: http://community.babycentre.co.uk/post/a5852125/rights_for_breastfeeding_in_publi

basically it's a bit piecemeal but I think the 2008 Equality Act was the one that clarified it (though up to 6 months - but beyond that the mother should be protected under sexual discrimination legislation).

[candj]

I can't believe that there are places (hospital, doctor's waiting room) where a woman would be asked not to breastfeed and to be made to go into the toilet to do so is disgusting and unhygienic, would they (the culprit asking) like to eat his/her lunch in a public toilet? And it is a shame to make a woman feel horrible about breastfeeding in public. I mean really! I remember breastfeeding in some chic restaurants in Paris on one holiday and no one (waiters or patrons) looked at me or made me feel uncomfortable and one of the waiters even brought a serviette for my baby and gently placed it on the table without saying a word!

To localmama, hope your not too traumatised by this experience and great that you have so much support here!

Best,

-C

[Ruth_Baldock]

Along with the huge support and outrage on localmama's behalf here, there is also a lot of support and discussion going on, in a livejournal community for breastfeeding- so the issue has gone worldwide (on the internet, anyway)