Carnegie library - occupy!!

[titch juicy]

Is the library in it's current incarnation always busy, or can it handle a downsize?

[enjoy]

-- moved topic --

[bodsier]

From 17,000 books to 600......bit of a leap......

[titch juicy]

blimey!

[PennyDreadful]

Yes, the thing is, the council's proposal is not for a downsize; it's for a fee-paying gym with a few random bookshelves (and no library staff, just gym staff). That's not downsizing a library, that's closing it.

The council have come up with such an ill-thought-out plan (including excavating the basement of the listed building) that they are not ready to go ahead with it straight away, which means that proceeding with closing the library on the arbitrary date of 1st April involves them paying lots of money to a security firm to protect the buildings while they work out what to do next. Half of the libraries in the borough of Lambeth were closed up and padlocked on the same day. That's a hell of a downsize. The council is suggesting that everyone can just use Brixton Library, but as the author Stella Duffy points out, that's already overstretched. https://stelladuffy.wordpress.com/2016/04/04/when-is-a-library-not-a-library/

It's my understanding that library staff in Lambeth had come up with a proposal that could have kept all the libraries open by running them as a 'staff mutual', but the council rejected this.

But anyway - whatever one's views on libraries - the main point I was trying to raise was the disgraceful nature of the response from councillors, who reacted to concerned queries by posting sneers, smears and 'amusing' cat photos..!

[Blah Blah]

The behaviour of some councillors has been childish and disgraceful. This is something to take up with their CLPs - especially given that they are paid around ?15k a year to serve - more if they hold cabinet or special positions. If they are going to make unpopular decisions, they should stand and defend those positions.

[Blah Blah]

I also think that what is behind this is a money raising exercise. There can be no other explanation for replacing a public service with a commercial enterprise. There is no interest whatsoever from the council in the keeping libraries open. It's the same with the Cressingham and Central Hill proposals - no interest in community led alternative porposals over profitable sell offs to the highest bidder. A shelf of books within a gym is NOT a library, neighbourhood or otherwise, and Lambeth are taking people for fools if they think no-one sees past the stupid use of words to try and suggest otherwise.

[Loz]

Blah Blah Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I also think that what is behind this is a money raising exercise.

I think it's partially a money raising exercise, but it's also a not-spending-money exercise. It can't be cheap to keep libraries up and running.

The person in the blog referenced a couple of posts ago wrote, "I live a five minute walk along the same street from the Carnegie Library, which has just been closed by Lambeth Council ? as has the Minet Library, another ten minutes away.". Honestly - was two libraries with 10-15 minutes walk of each other a good use of funds in a time where there is not a lot of money to go around?

It might be the cynic in me, but I suspect this is far and away the most people Carnegie Library has had in it for a while. But it would be interesting to see stats on usage, to see exactly what the demand is. Most people, understandably, like the idea of libraries, but how many actually use them in the age of the internet? I have a library card, but have only used it twice in about four years.

But whatever people think of the plans, the councillors tweeting cat pictures and generally not engaging is pretty damn poor. I'd like to think people will remember come the next elections, but I bet most of them get re-elected as the people blindly think, "ooh, Labour - tick".

[snowy]

Um, Minet does lots of other 'non library' things though. Like being the archive for bits of Lambeth.

[Blah Blah]

And libraries offer free internet and other services besides the loan of books. For the unemployed and poor with children, libraries are a valuable resource. How much do we put on the cost of every child having an equal stab at literacy for example, of which early access to books and language plays a huge part. Small local libraries tend to be used by the young and the old. And if you take a look at any of the large libraries offering things like study space, they are always oversubscribed. These things can not be measured in terms of financial profit. They are a public service central to both culture and learning.

Just on the point of there being two libraries within walking distance of each other, well Lambeth are closing both - so that's not really an argument is it. If one were being closed and the other kept open that would be different. Lambeth are doing to the Library system the same thing that has happened with other sectors, by trying to centralise the service into larger venues. But they are completely missing the point of libraries.

[Loz]

Blah Blah Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> And libraries offer free internet and other services besides the loan of books. For the

> unemployed and poor with children, libraries are a valuable resource. How much do we put on the cost

> of every child having an equal stab at literacy for example, of which early access to books and

> language plays a huge part. Small local libraries tend to be used by the young and the old. And if

> you take a look at any of the large libraries offering things like study space, they are always

> oversubscribed. [...] They are a public service central to both culture and learning.

I'm not denying any of that. If the libraries are well used and reaching significant numbers of the people you describe, then closing them would be definitely worth fighting.

My question is this: how much are each of the Lambeth libraries being used? Does anyone know if there any metrics available?

> These things can not be measured in terms of financial profit.

I agree, but it can be measured in terms of value for money. If Lambeth are spending ?x on libraries, how many people is that money spend reaching? That's the big question.

[bodsier]

The numbers using the library have doubled in recent times. I think that as it is getting more expensive to study, libraries will become increasingly important in closing the gap between the rich And the poor. As more people are being priced out of London, if the few that remain use the library and it improves their life chances, than in my opinion, it's money Well spent. It's unjustifiable to sacrifice our pubic services In light of the tax evasion/ avoidance that amounts to billions...

[bodsier]

This is just the start, they are planning to do the same with Brixton library also,....if you tolerate this, your local library could be next. It's an amazing atmosphere, go and support it if you can.

[Loz]

bodsier Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> The numbers using the library have doubled in recent times.

Do you have a source for that, or did you just make that figure up? And if you do have a source, doubled from what? If it went from 10 to 20, that's terrible. If it went from 100,000 to 200,000, then that's amazing. Which is it?

[minder]

Why would bodsier make that figure up?

[Loz]

minder Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Why would bodsier make that figure up?

Well, as they say, 73.6% of all statistics are made up on the spot.

Besides, if bodsier didn't make it up, bodsier will be able to provide a reputable source for it, won't they?

[enjoy]

A quick update with some upcoming events:

Come and support the efforts to keep the libraries open.

SOLIDARITY WITH THE JUNIOR DOCTORS STRIKE

8am Breakfast on the steps. Supporters! come and collect our special banner at 8am for

breakfast and then head down to support the Junior Doctors Strike at Kings.

7pm Candlelit vigil

Thursday 7th April 4pm Poet Jemima Foxtrot

4.30 Sian Berry Green Party Mayoral candidate visits

7pm Candlelit vigil

Friday 8th April 7pm Candlelit vigil

Saturday 9th April March for Lambeth Libraries Assemble Carnegie Library 11.30am

7pm Candlelit vigil

[malumbu]

A lovely building

There is a liklihood that the similarly lovely Forest Hill Library will be run by volunteers. Lewisham apparently aint so good on running libraries ie serving the community rather than small sectors of the community, whereas Southwark are. Of course we are talking Lambeth on this occasion.

For balance Lewisham score much better on public health services that some other LAs

[edhistory]

http://www.brixtonbuzz.com/2016/04/lambeth-issues-possession-order-as-carnegie-library-campaigners-stand-firm/

Who is paying for the electricity?

John K

[Cyclemonkey]

Hardly the most important or pressing issue here although I imagine like a lot of public bodies Lambeth Council will probably have a large multi site commercial contract with an energy provider that is probably paid monthly in arrears.

[simmonsl]

Just to address the people questioning the popularity and usage of Carnegie library, I was a regular user and have been for many years. They have a regular adult improver reading group, chess club, gallery, yoga groups and many other events that the librarians have worked so hard to plan and run for all the community. Also the baby/toddler story and singalong on Fridays which some days had 60 kids plus parents making it difficult to even get in.

The last 3 years at the hands of these dedicated librarians had meant that in terms of borrower numbers and users, this is actually one of the most used libraries in the borough.

So yes, the library is very, very busy.

[enjoy]

2000 people joined the protest march last saturday!

Wow!