largeginandtonic

I can't really remember in my current state of exhaustion, but I think that it was quite mild at the onset and then deteriorated quite sharply. I remember that I was completely desperate by the time I was prescribed Urso, and this would have been about 2-3 weeks after the first symptoms appeared. But I also had occasional better nights - after eating literally no fat or carbs all day. I had a section at 37 weeks and the condition had completely disappeared by the time I was discharged 2 days later. I agree with the others and think you should get the tests done just in case.

Alibo - did you have cholestasis or are you referring to different sorts of problems? My understanding is that cholestasis can be diagnosed only through blood tests, so seeing a consultant wouldn't necessarily help in the first instance - the consultant would simply ask for urgent liver function blood tests to be done before giving any advice. The same blood tests can also be demanded by GP's and midwives. Personally I'd want to get in front of anybody who could demand the blood tests asap (probably a midwife) and then push for a consultant's appointment afterwards - I'd be worried that demanding to see a consultant would only delay things. But that's only my opinion and I do agree with you about GP's being uninformed about pregnancy issues!

Hi Steph - I also had cholestasis in my last pregnancy (but not in my first) and second what Pickle says. The itching was unbearable. I also have scars on my legs! Luckily the urso did work for me, but the consultant wanted to wait until the bile acid test results came back before prescribing this for me, and this took about 10 days as Pickle says. In the meantime, you can take piriton and use various creams but they're not very effective. The only thing that helped was sticking my feet into a pillowcase full of ice packs! Also, with cholestasis the itching is worse at night so if there is any remote possibility of trying to sleep in the daytime and stay up at night, I would do that. I agree with PIckle that you need blood tests asap so seeing your GP is basically only going to delay things. If you can, I would call your midwife and get them to write out an urgent request for liver function tests to be done at KIng's - or get yourself down to MAU. Good luck

Hi there. I have a nearly 5 year old who has always been a bad sleeper and I know your pain! My feeling is that you somehow need to shift that 7pm bedtime back to something more like 7.30pm because otherwise you are effectively trapped into a cycle of early nights and early mornings. Kids this age apparently need around 11 hours sleep a night (of course it varies and writing things like this often prompts a wave of posts from parents of perfect sleepers who protest that their child was still sleeping 12 hours straight from 7 till 7 until about age 8 or something!) and I also think that 5am and 5.30am are classic vulnerable points in the night-time, in that kids seem to go into a v light sleep at these points and are prone to wake up, especially if they are light/poor sleepers generally (or need the loo like candj's lo). I think it's possible that if your little one has nearly had her 11 hours by the time she hits the vulnerable spot of 5.30am then it's natural for her to wake rather than carry on sleeping. I know you've said you tried a later bedtime, but did you give it a few weeks? I think that's how long it takes to notice the difference to be honest. Saying that, of course it's v hard to give it a few weeks during term time because of course she'll be pooped. So in your shoes I'd probably wait for the clocks to change in March and try to ensure that she doesn't adjust her body clock but sticks with a later bedtime. Or maybe wait for a Friday when she, for whatever reason, manages to sleep until 6am, seize that opportunity to shift bedtime forwards, stick with it over the weekend and hope that you can continue with it into the following week? I know that some of my little girl's friends will play themselves on waking up but mine certainly wouldn't! By the way there is an interesting thread running on mumsnet at the moment on why British kids are put to bed so 'early' compared to other countries with lots of differing and interesting viewpoints.

Ha - Fuschia you must have a better looking tummy than mine then - mine is not fit for public viewing! Have skimmed that article and will read more later. Always good stuff on mumsnet re extended b'feeding I think. We've come a long way with our attitudes to bfing in this country but we do still need to be less bashful. My 4.5 year old was having a banana milkshake yesterday and announced to the whole cafe that if I ate a banana then shook myself about a bit, my 9 month old would get 'banana boobie shake'. That got some looks too. I just stare back.

I am a HUGE fan of Boob tops - from Pretty Pregnant on Northcross Road. I have tried loads of breastfeeding tops, from cheap to expensive and these are just head and shoulders above the rest. I have two and I wear them when I know I'm going to be doing a lot of breastfeeding out, e.g. on the bus, at softplay or whatever - they are discreet but don't involve faffing about with lots of floaty layers, the opening was in the perfect place (unlike jojo tops which always seemed to open up too low down if you see what I mean), they wash brilliantly, look great - can't recommend them highly enough! When not wearing these, I just wear stretchy t-shirts that I can pull down.

To snowboarder: I've read a number of your posts on other threads and you remind me of myself a few years ago. My 4.5 year old was like your son sounds. I started out trying to fit her into routines, followed all sorts of advice, felt like every day was a battle which I lost. Eventually (at around a year? I can't remember?) I gave up - we co-slept, rocked her to sleep for naps, stopped tearing my hair out when she woke constantly and just tried to go with the flow more. I never really felt like I cracked the sleep thing, she just got older. With my son (9 months) I thought I'd just start out with the o-sleeping, demand-feeding, sling-carrying approach from the beginning to see if a more relaxed, natural approach would work better. You know what, he is a v happy chap but he's a dreadful sleeper! (sleeping in sling at the mo as I bob up and down - up a gazillion times last night). So I have tried both extremes and neither produced a good sleeper. Either I am just plain rubbish at parenting or I produce crap sleepers - probably a mixture of the two. What I can promise you, though, is that sleep will be a much less important part of your lives as your son grows up. Yes, there will be other issues but you will be better able to face them. The thing about sleep deprivation is that you feel crap and are less able to parent in the way you want. When the sleep gets better (and it will - promise!) you can face other parenting issues on a level playing field with other parents, if that makes sense, I.e. not crippled with sleep deprivation. I would love to meet you if you ever need a sympathetic coffee. (Sorry for thread hijack!)

If you could do some sort of class suitable for 4/5 year olds then I'd also sign up my little girl tomorrow!

Hey Crystal & snowboarder...I have been there too. My 4 year old was a really rubbish sleeper - woke loads in the night and really resisted naps. I read all the books and tried loads of 'techniques' in an effort to control her and get her to do what the books said she should or could be doing. None of it worked, she got more and more overtired and I made myself seriously ill. Daytime sleep was a really big problem as I remember, because she could never get through a 40 minute sleep cycle - her little eyes would just ping open and she'd be wide awake, no matter how tired. In the end, I gave up and started co-sleeping and wearing her in a sling for naps. It got better by itself - she woke less at night, the naps started lengthening and she stopped resisting them. I can't remember the exact timings but I think that her night sleep became better (i.e. 1 wake up, quick feed,back to sleep) at around 10 months and she started sleeping through reliably at 2 years. Day sleep got better when she was about 1. She still struggles with sleep and is not a perfect sleeper, but it's fine and a gazillion times better than when she was a baby. I didn't know it then, but I've since realised that her sleep patterns were entirely normal - not normal for a 'good sleeper' and not what the books say of course, but nonetheless normal. I now have a 5-month old and I'm much less stressed out by it. He's waking every 3 hours at night and I'm carrying him for his naps. It's OK. It will pass. As for sleep training, we tried various things with my daughter apart from full blown cry-it-out strategies but she screamed hysterically and everything we tried (including baby whisperer techniques and other ideas from sleep clinics/experts) seemed to make it worse. The idea of putting her down awake but drowsy or leaving her to settle herself was just laughable - she screamed like we were torturing her if she was put down. I'm more open-minded about sleep training no.2 if it comes to that - he has a different personality and doesn't scream like his sister - but I don't think anyone should be pushed into sleep training and I do think it's sad that our society seems so focussed on offering solutions to what are described as problems but what are actually normal sleep patterns. Maybe a bit more acceptance of what is normal and a bit more support for tired mums would be better. I'm not sure what the point of this long post really is, but I guess I just wanted to say you are definitely not alone.

Have you tried mumsnet? (www.mumsnet.com). The discussion boards are really good and I expect you'll find loads of advice from searching old threads for the issues that interest you. I had no end of sleep nightmares with my first child and found that the HV's were useless, the baby books drove me demented as I tried to implement their various strategies (none of which worked) and my NCT group were not that much help either since all the other mums had babies who slept. Mumsnet was a great source of advice and support. I agree with Mellors - once you have a second baby you just stress out less!

Thanks everyone! Moos, where is your dentist? We have that Harry book too! Fuschia (waves hello - hope we have another meet-up at some point) that dentist looks great but I don't have a car! I'm trying to find someone very local if poss. Thanks for your recommendation Pickle! I don't know Forest Hill Road but will look it up.. Keep 'em coming - I will be very grateful!

Can anyone recommend a good dentist for my 4 year-old girl in east dulwich? Needs to be someone who's kind and ideally a woman. Thanks!

I will PM you!

According to the report, satisfactory means average/below average. It's surely reasonable to be concerned about a below average grade? I am in the same position as Zaardvark and no, I'm not looking for a selective school filled with high achievers. I want a good school where kids of all backgrounds mix together and come out with a good education. Surely we shouldn't shrug our shoulders and accept that 'below average' is OK just because it's a large state school with a mixed intake? I'm not so much concerned about the SATS, which I agree depends on the intake, but the quality of the teaching, ethos of the school and the way in which the school approaches kids of all academic abilities. Zaardvark, I'm just hoping that the report will have prompted some action at the school and that things will turn themselves around. What do other DKH parents think?

I'm looking forward to it! How will we recognise each other? I'll be looking out for twins I guess. I'll be wearing a small baby in a sling and looking lost.

We live near that area. I think it's lovely. Do you know about Lettsom Gardens? That will be right on your doorstep. IMO the key advantage of living in Camberwell is that you have much better transport links into town. That's important if you want the shortest commute possible. If commuting into town isn't important then I guess you might prefer to be in the thick of it in East Dulwich. I would agree that the Grove Park area seems a bit quiet so perhaps could feel more isolated. Don't know anything about commuting into Dulwich College though.

10 is good for me too - though I'll need to leave by 11 for the nursery run. Look forward to meeting you all!

Can I join? I'd like to make some new mummy-friends in the area and although I'd love to fit in to the usual mum & baby groups and think of myself as a pretty inclusive person I'm beginning to find the constant eyebrow-raising at my sling-wearing, co-sleeping habits a bit depressing. I am free on July 14th - I have a 4-year old in nursery till 11.30am and a 12-week old who'll be busy all day making various rods for my own back....