Ladymuck

> It works out we pay around ?12 per month for this > shower for two tv channels and a half dozen radio > networks. I have one telly and one freeview box. With those I am able to watch dozens of all manner of channels etc. (including a Russian one and Al Jazeera) for the cost of the TV licence. Unfortunately I don't have the time as I'm always on here, but I think that, if I did, it would be fair value. > Sky for ?21 gives a hundred channels and more > radio networks than one knows what to do with. At the end of the day, there are only so many channels you can watch. I guess it boils down to personal preference too. Some people, for example, have Sky purely for the live football matches.

> ...I personally think he (lordmuck) has no problems > with his bag of cash to the cleaner... >... My gut feeling is to say fear not fair 'Mucks' > your fears are totally unfounded and I should very > much doubt there is any scam involved. Music to my bewildered and befuddled ears, acumenman. Thanks for the lengthy response. When I read a post like this I am driven to simply follow my intuition and - as many of you have opined - just "go for it". Cue another long discussion with hubby over skype again later tonight.

Graham Norton?

> Has your hubby asked what happens if the cash goes > missing? Maybe he should discuss this with the > hotel "management", even if just via email.Sounds > as if it hasn't occurred to them that this might > cause anxiety in their guests. Gosh, I think you might be right. > Also, how long is he there for? What about paying > for one week upfront in cash, see how it goes and > if all seems OK, then pay a bigger amount and get > a bigger discount next time? Again, consideration of the risk management thing...contract is for 5 months.

Rub it in Mick Mac...

Just to pass on what Eddie M has mentioned on his thread in the "What's On" section: due to the recent homicide, the forum which was due to take place at 5.45 tonight has been postponed until further notice.

Very, very tragic. The families are going to receive one hell of a shock. My sympathies go out to them all.

> Ladymuck - is your Hubby working with any locals? > > If so, why doesn't he ask then what they would > do? > It might turn out to be a perfectly usual way of > doing business in that particular hotel?! > > My philosophy when overseas is always seek local > advice if not sure. What a brilliant philosophy! Thank you! Hubby is working with locals (only since the last 3 days tho.).

Ed Byrne

What do they stink of? Do you mean chemical type fumes? Is that legal?

>... he could send a > further email stating that he has left the cash > and if there was any dispute he could use that as > some form of evidence that he had done as he was > asked. (tu) I think that damage limitation...or as HAL put it earlier, risk management, is going to be key here in helping to clear the mind as to what course of action to eventually take. I dearly want to trust. On the whole, it's good for the soul and for humankind (in my opinion). After all, by distrusting the hotel owners, aren't we effectively treating them as potential criminals when, in reality we have no right to do so? Sure, there are some scary elements to this very bizarre situation hubby and I find ourselves in, but for me, whilst they do provoke a certain degree of anxiety, I am not wholly convinced that these suspicions are sufficient reason to lose faith in people and the world in general. After all, many of us are happy to trust - for example - no-nonsense plainly packaged "basics" ranges in Tescos in exchange for a cheaper product. And lots of us don't even think twice about trusting Ryanair with their stripped-down airline service; again, in exchange for a bargain airfare. Some of us have had our suspicions raised (including me - and definitely hubby) because cash is being asked for, in a room, to be collected by their cleaner, at some point. As Mr. Twirly has implied, are we perhaps making unhealthy assumptions here? Could it not be that this company's way of operating is merely an extension of the Tescos or Ryanair model? I.e. to do business in the most uncomplicated manner possible and to offer a product which consists of only the bare essentials and deliberately jettisons excess in return for a favourable hotel rate? On the other hand - we may be about to be taken for a ride. Oh gawd! I still don't know!

He's picking on me again... (well this is the tattle tale and snitching thread)

Sean...

> Why are people assuming it's a tax dodge, is it > just because it's cash? Maybe they're reducing > costs by avoiding credit card charges. Sounds like > an incredibly no frillls hotel to me. Maybe they > don't get enough guests to employ fulltime staff? Absolutely. And the hotel IS incredibly no frills. I've seen the room (via his webcam when skyping me). > However, if he is going to leave cash, find out > which day and what time this cleaner is showing > up. Either hang around if possible to meet the > cleaner or at least minimise the amount of time > it's lying around. Definitely worth mentioning to him; though being in attendance at the same time as the cleaner is probably going to prove impossible if during working hours (it's a new job). But if he can at least find out which day...

Bah...couldn't focus on jogging...emotional turmoil and all that... > Well if the leaving of cash if of concern, why not rebook a room > in your name for example. He can be Ladymuck (god help him) and > save the extra 20%. A fine idea, except that the discount doesn't apply when booking on-line (so would be futile). Strange, it's usually the opposite way around.

Thanks for your further input guys, but this is genuinely bothering me. Not in the way you all think, I suspect. I have spent most of the night thinking about this and emailing hubby with my thoughts while he slept. I thought of Warren Buffet, that very successful and charismatic businessman who is known for frequently doing business on nothing more than a handshake: where there could be millions at stake. He has done well, but - most importantly - he seems genuinely happy in himself. I have spoken to hubby again, who himself sent a further email to the hotel (yes, emailing the very hotel he was sitting/typing in - I realise it sounds bizarre). A very pleasant reply from a lovely-laid-back-sounding-Finn says that there is no problem and that if he leaves the cash in the room, the receipt will actually follow a couple of days later. He has this in writing. He's in a hotel. These emails must be trackable. I think hubby would have probably checked out by now had it not been for: (1) If he pays by cash he obtains a discount of 20%+. (2) If he pays one month in advance (as opposed to daily) he gains a further similar saving. (3) Me - and my opposite viewpoints. But I am driven by emotions and intuition - and that is probably not rational. It's a really tough one; but one post keeps haunting me. It is this one: "...I get more of a thrill when people show themselves up to be good. What you know living in south-London doesn't always apply abroad or elsewhere in the country and if you stick to what you know you never learn." I need to - somehow - clear my head. I'm going for a jog.

*sniff*

> Your OP referred to hotel "management".... Yes, that's what I thought originally. See my post about six posts back: timed at 1.04...we must have cross-posted. Thanks BTW.

I SO don't want to believe this is a scam.:( People in that part of the world really are extremely nice and very, very honest (as some of you have pointed out).

There is no manager/front desk/staff apart from a weekly cleaner.

> If he has a problem appearing not to trust them, > just tell them that he needs to hand it over and > get a receipt for tax purposes. Might help save > face. Or do the booking online as suggested. Well...this is where I seem to have got things arse about tit. When I said that hubby had offered to hand over the cash to someone and was told that he would have to leave it in his room, I had (wrongly!) assumed that hubby had spoken to someone. Well, why shouldn't I. But, to my surprise, I have just found out that hubby has spoken to N0-ONE. Not a soul! Apparently, all these "conversations" (where I assumed that he had actually spoken to human beings) have being via email!. There doesn't appear to be anyone at the hotel! Apart from my hubby!::o On quizzing hubby further by saying e.g. "what about these laid back members of staff you talked about?", he simply replied: "they were laid back via email". Well f-uck me!!! How could I have got it so wrong? Summary: Hubby is in a hotel where there is no staff (whatsoever). Apparently a cleaner goes in once a week, though he hasn't seen him/her as yet. All the "conversations" between hubby and all these nice sounding, lovely laid back Finns have been via computer!!!! The computer wants him to leave a wad of cash in the room for the elusive cleaner to collect, in exchange for which the cleaner will leave a receipt. Simple really! Don't know why we are making such a fuss! Jesus, Mary, Joseph, Allah and good people of ED; what now?

> This is an internet hotel! The management probably > hasn't even seen most of the guests - who knows > who they really are? This is an internet-hotel in the truest sense. It turns out there is NO management there. All conversations have taken place via email. Its sounds really creepy - a bit Bates Motel LOL! Doesn't look as though there are any other guests either. You enter and leave via a code (given out by - yes - a computer)!

> By the way...have you seen the movie 'Hostel'? It > suddenly comes to mind.....hotel in the middle of > nowhere...the only one....leave the cash on the > table to be collected.......just saying like > lol.....;-) This hotel wasn't out in the sticks about an hours' drive outside of Helsinki, by any chance LOL? You have to laugh!

> Can't he re-book the extension and pay online > again as he (presumably) did for the original > booking? You can, but it costs a good 20%+ more to do so. Once you are already there, you get a massive discount for cash payment should you wish to extend your stay. But it gets weirder...

Oh karter, I should be laughing, but I'm not. Update: I have just finished quizzing hubby. It seems I got everything arse about tit!:-S. See separate posts below. I don't know WHAT to think now.