trinity

YellowHairedLady Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > > Out of 3,500 persons killed that makes 3,500 too > many. Also, given the high levels of collusion > between British Army and Loyalist paramilitaries > you could easily make it 60% / 40%. No you can't - you can not add the number of people killed by terrorists to those killed by security forces. There was some collusion and certainly bad mistakes made by both the army and the police force but the aim of the security forces was first and foremost the protection of all civilians in Northern Ireland. The aim of the terrorists on both sides was to kill the opposing lot's civilians. > My point with the security forces was actually, > why did agents of the Government (soldiers / > police) who were supposed to be neutral, > peacekeepers, kill so many people, and so many > innocent people at that ( thought I am certain > they were not all innocent). And why were the > vast, vast, majority of them from one side. According to the book 'Lost Lives' approx 160 Catholic civilians and 23 Protestant civilians were killed were killed by the security forces (army and RUC). In fact the IRA killed more Catholic civilians than the security forces. The reason that many more Catholic civilians were killed (with most deaths occurring in the early 70's) is because the IRA targeted the Army in fire fights and the army returned fire with civilians being caught in the crossfire. Loyalists did not target the army and so Protestant civilians were not endangered in this way. There was no systemic targeting of Catholic civilians by security forces. The army and the RUC were (for the most part) neutral. > > For example, I have lived in Ireland, England > (still do), Australia and New Zealand. In each of > these Countries / Nations, I have never walked > down the street fearing that I may be shot by > agents of the Government. But in none of these countries were you in danger of being blown to bits by a car bomb whilst eg shopping for school clothes for your kids, laying poppies at a rememberance service or using the local launderette. (Omagh, Enniskillen and Albertbridge Road.) Don't get me wrong I lump all the terrorists together - IRA, UDA, PIRA, UFF - all murdering scum. But you are wrong, very wrong, to suggest that the security forces can be compared to these murdering b******s.

But Brendan you can't tell in a forum who is English and who is not. I grew up in Belfast - my opinion is valid and based on years of first hand experience. I don't know if Huguenot has a connection with Northern Ireland but his remarks are spot on.

Thank you Huguenot and Jimbob for your response. I too was horrified by Azul's comment and too angry to reply coherently.

There are a number of things that I think may have been put before the child such as the mother's rights the mother's needs the effort involved in updating the database of case notes the time required to liaise effectively with other agencies the desire to deal with the next less demanding case or patient The irritation the professionals may have felt at having to deal with yet another incompetent parent The extra work needed if a child is to be removed from his parent.

I'm firmly with quids and microbite on this one. The signs of severe neglect and abuse were there and the professionals who we trust to protect these vunerable children (the doctors, social workers and police) did not do their job properly. Do I believe I would have picked up on it if I had visited? Yes. The injuries the child sustained over a period of months are not normal and can not be explained away. I think the professionals in this case did not put the child first. That is the only thing of importance.

I was told that Therapia Road was built in 1897 and the others presumably at the same/similar time. The houses were built for a regiment with strong connections with the Crimean war (perhaps they won colours there??). The 1920's end of the Road was the stables for that regiment at the time the Victorian part of the road were built. No idea what the evidence for this is but just passing on what I heard.

The 363 will go right past your house but is not as frequent as the 63 which ends on Forest Hill Road. Forest Hill Road is only a short walk away and so you could pick up more buses there. Also you are not far from the top end of Lordship Lane and can pick up any buses that run down to the bright lights of the strip. As previously mentioned you are very close to the P13 which also runs down to the fun end of Lordship Lane and Sainsburys. For trains you are probably 20mins walk away from both Forest Hill Station and Honor Oak Park.

Except that ofsted have decided that 'satisfactory' is not satisfactory. They stated that lessons should be good or above. Anything less is not acceptable and not satisfactory. Bit confusing isn't it.

Whilst I agree that some au-pairs are not up to the job of looking after children I also think that at 9 and 7 the children ought to know how to behave. If they are acting like this then I would be reluctant to lay the blame entirely at the feet of the au-pair who may only have been looking after them for a few months and may have "inherited" badly behaved children. If at that age they were behaving this badly I would look towards the parents and wonder why they had allowed this situation to build up. Alternatively everyone could have been having an off day.

I live very close to the FHT Woodie and I haven't noticed any noise late at night. In fact I thought that it has been much better than a few years ago. It will be interesting to get a few more opinions as it may be that I'm a really heavy sleeper now and a few years ago I would have been up every night with a new baby!

Hi Tegid - used Sainsbury's at 10.45 in morning , transaction happened in US at 4am our time. No I have used my cards in lots of other places (a few on Lordship lane and many online) I just mentioned Sainsburys, somerfield and the garage because they had been highlighted on this thread. Additionally I don't use any cashpoints on Lordship lane which has also been mentioned on the thread.

Had my phonecall this morning from Natwest. My card has been cloned and used in the US. I only use cash for the garage, haven't used somerfield for 6 months but I did use Sainsbury's for the first time in a month yesterday. I used the cigarette counter (for a newspaper and cashback) thinking it would be safer than the ATM's outside. There seems to be a spate of cloning in ED at the moment. Can the administrator do a bit of maths and tell us what % of forum users have reported cloning on this forum in the last couple of weeks. (Only obviously if you have nothing better to do on a Saturday at the height of summer:) )

Sainsbury's does do just free range chicken breasts (not organic) but they are very difficult to find in the chicken aisle. I can't remember the name but I did eventually find some. Also you can deposit your used plastic bags in the recycling centre at the end of the car park.

No vouchers have arrived here on Therapia Road. Have we been forgotten?

I tried the rustic baguette that I bought from the coffee shop yesterday. Delicious, so I will be returning for more today.

Knomester - are you sure that it is a speed bump they are putting across the entrance to the street and not just one of the wide ramps which brings the road up to kerb height for crossing at the corner. Therapia Road, Mundania Road and Marmora were all given them and they haven't caused any issues as far as I can see. Not like a speed bump at all because they are quite wide & flat across the top. Cate I think the speed bumps where taken out of Colyton Road because the heavy traffic going to the thames water project couldn't cope with them.

I visited as well today and was impressed with the fairy cakes, sandwiches and bread. The decor did have a feel of having been done on a very tight budget but welcoming none the less. Good friendly service and I am looking forward to visiting again.

Do you think if the line had been left in place it would currently be viable? It would mean 2 extra stations serving the south of East Dulwich connecting us to London Bridge and in the other direction West Dulwich(ish) & Crystal Palace. My thoughts are that it would have saved me many a trip round the South Circular.

Thank you - it seems there was also a railway bridge crossing Forest Hill Road then. Shame there is no photo of the bridge & surroundings but interesting even so.

Looking at the links and photos posted here it seems there was also an Honor Oak station (different to Honor Oak Park) which sat at the junction of Woodvale and Forest Hill Road and was the preceding stop to Lordship Lane. Any photos of that station?

Interesting painting but I am confused. Am I right that the line ran along Brenchly gardens, behind Wood Vale and then crossed Lordship Lane with the station on the right hand side of LL if you were looking up the hill? If so I can't quite work out where Lordship Lane is in this picture. Is it running down the painting from the station to the middle left hand side? By the way I also find maps a bit tricky to all those who think it is perfectly obvious.

Any thoughts on the date of the photo Macroban?

I think we might be giving the wrong impression here. You can't get a seat on a morning rush hour train - sorry to disappoint all those ED'rs who think they may have found commuting's holy grail. It's just that if it weren't for the hill it would be really handy.

In addition having the 363 run past Francesca Cabrini school might just ease the school run congestion which is pretty bad at this school.

I think this is a great idea. Honor Oak Park is a very useful station which I use frequently. (I walk and it takes about 14mins at a fairly brisk pace). Even with a bus going up the hill I would still probably walk but I think it would make Honor Oak Park a viable commuter station for those at the top end of Lordship lane. I'm off to the website now.