bornagain

Do you have a plan B if the hospital site is not available or is it pretty much a shoo-in?

I don't think I've ever said that this area does not need a new school. All I have said (again and again) is that we need to look at education provision for the region as a whole (ie not just ED) and look at the provision not just for the next few years but for the future. Everyone seems so fixed on this proposed new school that any other ideas to provide places seems to be rejected. What happens to your children in the next few years concern those of you on this thread. But there needs to be someone out there that should be looking out for what happens in education not just in the next few years but in the years beyond that. And there isn't because the system is now a free for all because of the current government policy. That is all.

I am sorry to have wound you both up - probably a step too far. As I have said before though, I am very interested in the educational provision in this area and it is important to put other points of view out there and have a discussion. I am so sorry that you are both so stressed about your own situation.

Building a new school is not to be undertaken lightly. I am not saying don't build the school but we should think and plan on a regional level before we do. Unfortunately as the current education policy and their use of academies and free schools have meant that really no one is in charge of the overall set up for the area. It costs tens of MILLIONS of pounds to build and staff. It is not just for the next few years, but for the next few decades. It is an investment for the local community - one that we should ensure that we (ie the community) really needs.

You can get to Pimlico Academy by just sitting on the 185 bus and getting off just after Vauxhall. It is much closer than the Oratory or Greycoats to which many children go from here. Also I am not quite sure what you mean by 'being part of a wider community'? Surely travelling to an area outside Dulwich will combine you with the wider London community? I do see your point that there have been several bulge classes in the last few years which will have to be accomodated in secondary soon but who knows whether this is going to be a permanent increase in school age children in this area or just a blip? Has anyone tried to find out? This is the kind of information that a strategic body could gather so that wise and not knee jerk plans can be made. There could well be a scenario in few years time where property in ED is so expensive that most young families other than those that are very rich are priced out of living here. Those that remain will send their children to private schools. What will happen to the proposed school then - they will be half empty - what a waste!

"And a school run by Southwark which I note that James is now saying is possible but would take longer ." Intexas, which school is that?

Your poor son, ghastly isn't it? My teen has similar problems and she uses this. Quite pricey but it does work. May not clear all but enough to make a real difference. http://www.skinmed.co.uk/uk/AKNICARE__4_Product_System_with_Remover.html

But DenmotherSmith, to be fair to Southwark education, they are largely toothless due to the current government's policy. All the secondary schools in the borough are academies which basically means that they can do what they like to a certain extent. It is a mess.

Education provision like health provision is far too important to be left to the whim of elected politicians and local pressure groups. I don't blame local parents for wanting good education for their children. Of course they will put their all into agitating for something fantastic to be provided. And of course those with the loudest voices and best connections will be heard. But the system should be robust enough to take a dispassionate view of the whole picture, both geographically and also into the future. Education provision should not be decided by elected politicans campaigning with their next re-election in mind (sorry James, but if you are honest with yourself, this does play a part in your activities). Who is to say that East Dulwich is going to remain nappy valley for ever. If you read other threads on this forum it appears that families are moving out in droves. We have to only look at Kingsdale to see an example of a school that was at one time so unpopular that no one locally would touch with a barge pole. Kids were bussed in from as far as away as Bermondsley. Now look at it. It took a team with strategic vision to turn it around. This is what we should be doing with these less popular schools in the borough. But this can only happen if there is an institution - Southwark comes to mind - that can taken a strategic view and taken ownership of the entire education system both now and into the future.

Here is my chicken rice recipe - one pot dish, really easy. I serve it with either green beans or a salad. I wrote it out for my daughter hence the v. explict instructions! Turn the oven on to 180C Peel and cut 2 large onions into thin slices. Peel and cut 2 cloves of garlic into small bits. Take the chicken pieces out of the packet and cut off any fat. Leave the skin on. 4 chunky thighs with bones in should be enough for 4 people (1 each). Heat up a large pan that can go in the oven. Drizzle some oil into it and when hot, put the chicken pieces in skin side down. Leave them to cook without moving for at least 5 minutes until the skin is crispy underneath. Be patient! If you try to move them too soon, they will stick to the pan. Turn the pieces over and cook the other size for a similar length of time. When they are ready, they will be quite golden and crispy on the outside but still raw on the inside. Take the chicken out and put them in a bowl. Next, fry the onions and garlic in the same pan in the chicken juices and fat. Keep stirring until the onions are translucent. Do not let the garlic burn (black) or it will turn bitter. Now put in 2 small cups (size of a tea cup) of paella rice into the pan. Keep stirring. The rice will also go a bit translucent. Don't let anything burn. Cut 2 red/orange/yellow (but not green!) peppers into strips, making sure that you take out the seeds first. Put them in the pan. Take 2 handfuls of mushroom and cut them up if necessary. If the mushroons are small (size of small pebbles) keep them whole. If they are larger (size of conkers or bigger) cut them in half/quarters so they are all the same size. Put them in the pan. Fill the glass you used to measure the rice and fill up with water. Put it in the pan. Stir. Repeat this with another full glass and a half glass. There should be 2 and half glasses of water in the pot. Put in EITHER 1 stock cube OR 2 teaspoons of stock powder OR 1 tub of stock jelly. Stir again until mixed. Turn the heat off. Lay the cooked chicken, skin side up on top of the rice mixture. Also pour in any juice that has collected at the bottom of the bowl. Cover the pan and put in the oven. Cook for around 45minutes to 1 hour until all the liquid has gone and the rice is nice and plump and juicy. Enjoy!

Shuggy, I do not blame you for pressing for what you want. I would not expect any less. It is true though that there is a north/south divide in the borough socio-economically and it would be disingenuous to say otherwise. You may be happy to send your kids to those schools but many others wouldn't. My criticism really is towards the system - Southwark and the politicians. There is no strategic plan for education provision in the borough. From what James just said, with just a bit of pressure from him, Southwark has gone from one stance (i.e. no need for new school) to agreeing to having one. What kind of strategy is that? By the way do you have a site yet for the proposed school? Is it going to be on the hospital site?

re: Peckham Academy - there indeed are vacancies - James posted it himself - see one of the attachments of the schools with vacancies this year. http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?29,1278956 Actually for ED kids Aylesbury Estate is not hard to get to - one bus - either 176 or 40 - will take you there. I can understand why ED parents would prefer a lovely brand spanking new school in leafy ED compared to a school on a council estate in gritty Walworth (shudder - spare the thought!) BUT in the interests of the community as a whole (and this includes all those people who do not have children or have children who are no longer in education) politicians should be looking at ways of making these schools which appear to not to be that attractive, attractive. It is a waste of resources throwing money after new projects when there are ways of utilising existing resources.

Thank you Shuggy for a clear statement of where you are re: the new school. I think you are right when you say that from where you sit on the panel everything is clear and transparent - but from outside looking in, it appears less so. While those parents whose children will be directly involved ie those in years 3 and 4 currently have a personal interest in this venture, the proposed school because it will be funded through the public purse will be of interest to the entire community (whether they have children or not) and hence the need for transparency. I take an interest in the whole education debate locally and it does concern me that the drive to set up individual schools distracts from looking at the overall education strategy for the borough as a whole. For example there are schools that are not full in other parts of the borough - so perhaps efforts should be made to enable these places to be taken up first before setting up a brand new school? It is a great shame that the local authority who is in the best position to orchestrate a borough-wide strategy can't because of the current government's policy.

simonethebeaver (who I think is on the steering group) said: "Transparency is really important to the steering group and ways to engage with the whole community are already on the agenda of our next meeting in the next few days. " This is quite in contradiction to the last response from James who essentially told this thread (ie at least a part of the community) to mind our own business! ETA it wasn't just intexas and I who asked (I know we have badgered you at times re: education related questions :D) - others also asked the question re: Charter.

Ok, may be this child has too much of a sense of entitlement! I still think that at 5, although they in theory should know better, it's easy for them to be tempted. I hope your little girl gets her toy back.

Aske's used to until around 5 years ago operate a quasi grammar admissions policy using interviews/musical scholarships etc to choose students who were academically above the norm. This has changed now as they have been forced by Lewisham to prioritise local children which includes a merger with a local (previously failing) primary school. As I understand it, it is now quite a different school, not necessary worse but certainly not the school it was then. Reflecting the new more egalitarian intake, the results are generally not as good.

Agree with Saffron about neutral territory and nicer now the weather is warmer. I think that 5 is still very young. It's possibly old enough to know that stealing is wrong, but young enough to succumb to temptation. Perhaps this little girl comes from a family that may not have such nice necklaces/toys as yours? Assuming that your child goes to one of the state primaries, I think we should be mindful that many children do not have many toys/clothes etc that other children enjoy. As for vetting your children's friends - my policy is to always let my children choose their own friends, even from a very young age (they are both at secondary school now). I think you are setting yourself up for problems later on if you encourage/discourage friendships based on whether you like their family or not. Its not about you, it's about your children. On occasions there were children that they befriended some that I wasn't that keen on, but actually it is part of growing up to learn to deal with this themselves. You can always be in the background for her to turn to if necessary but if you are supportive but leave her to her own devices it will be fine.

Yes, agree about Harris, but why not Charter? Are they not keen? Or have they not been approached? If not why not?

Thanks intexas for pointing out the intricacies of admissions policies. I don't think it is obvious necessarily as we tend to assume that when we compare schools we are comparing like with like. Charter is on safe walking distance. Kingsdale is a lottery but also use a banding system to reflect 'the full range of ability'. They also allocate 15% of their intake to various scholarships. This is why the value-added statistics are more useful than raw results.

Thanks every one! Sherlock aka my DH has come good and have deduced that it is our outside socket. Have called electrician.

This is a long shot but we are a bit flummoxed. For the last week or so we have had a spate of the rcd tripping in our house cutting off our electricity. A bizarre pattern of five or six times in as many minutes then ok for around 20 hours and then repeat. It's a real pain as you can imagine and we have tried troubleshooting by disconnecting suspect devices but nothing seems to be the cause. Just wondered if there are any external factors at large?

> > > yeah I guess it works out ok for the bright > > kids > > > who don't get expelled for bringing the > overall > > > results down. Tough shit if you're not > academic > > I > > > guess. > > > > That's a serious allegation that the evidence > > provided in this thread does not substantiate. > If That was my question TE44. Where is the evidence that these children have been expelled? I'm happy to be corrected but I cannot see it from the 'evidence' produced by others in this thread. > > you have the evidence that does so I would > suggest > > that you get in touch with the relevant > > authorities. If you do not then I would suggest > > you calm down. > > > Which evidence edmummy? But wasn't this the starting point of this thread - that schools have been removing students from the roll to enhance their GCSE results?

Good point intexas and given the latest revelations by TE44's link there may be far more to this than meets the eye. If half of what is alleged in that link is true, then Harris needs a top to toe investigation. This whole issue is not about whether schools should be run as businesses or not, it's about probity and the integrity of the education system. I expect that most academies are run well and with integrity but if some are seen to be less so then it is the responsibility of the secretary of state (for he is ultimately in charge of the academy and free school system) to ensure that they are run without reproach.

I am not trying to rubbish Harris. But I am critical of the entire Harris PR machine. Bamboozling parents with statistics is something that most schools seem to do now and I deplore it. I agree with you James, that given that many of the schools were failing, Harris is probably doing a better job than the previous management. This is what is important.

JB said - Ebacc scores, 18% of Harris students achieved the English Baccalaureate 2013, up from 8.8% in 2012. Ah, the wonders of statistics! The reason that the Ebacc score is 18% is because this is the average for the entire chain. It is greatly inflated by the impressive 40% achieved by Harris Crystal Palace and the scores for the rest of the chain is not quite so impressive - see attached table. Anyway 18% is nothing to boast about as the national average is 23%. As I said in my post above, only 4 Harris schools got national average or above. The rest (8 schools) got below, some in single figures. In comparison Charter, Sydenham School (girl's state), Haberdasher Askes, Elm Green all score higher than 30% (ie above national average). They are all state comprehensives on a par with the Harris schools. Sacred Heart in Camberwell scores a fantastic 58%. There's lies, damned lies and statistics!