Sephiroth

As this is the current place to discuss Nige and his party - it seems unlikely, does it not, that Russia would chuck tens of thousands of pounds and just one obscure UKIP MP? can’t wait to see how deeper this goes (specifically I’m looking at more senior politicians such as Farage and Johnson)

Oh he 100% means my post - but Dave is…. Well, his voting history speaks for itself.

I see the usual fluffers (Dan hodges, Andrew Neil. That lot) are calling this a stick up that needs its own enquiry. “Things were moving fast, we had to wait for advice, Johnson acted nobly”) which ignores: - other countries suffered first, warned and we laughed at them “the Italians have nothing to teach us” wrote hodges - other countries were equally bamboozled by events but took the potential far more seriously and took appropriate action - after lockdown Johnson continued to behave as if it was no thing - “let the bodies pile high” People can excuse Johnson if they want - but they too will be judged accordingly

Near perfect encapsulation. Kudos earl

Are you telling me to pack my bags then Dave? have I taken too much from your country already? what about all the English abroad - where you going to put them when the arrive back if they get chucked out by their host countries? grow up man

Brexit - but not simply the act of leaving the EU, as damaging as that is in and of itself But everything around it. - the madness of "taking back control", "they need us more than we need them", the increase in volume and extremity of lies required to get it over the line, the clear denial of reality - all of that has led to the current situation where parties of left and right can win huge majorities and find out the beast of anti-immigration can never be sated the course correction involves acknowledging as a country that we need immigration and lots of it (related: acknowledge we aren't as special case when it comes to asylum and refugees - other countries take proportionally more) We need to be part of the EU. Climate change in and of itself will see global increase in migrations - we need to be building systems that welcome and accommodate the future - not stick our heads in the sand like hobbits If we don't collectively agree around this then the descent into authoritarian right-wing madness will continue

Absolutely mental what Labour have become/are doing because I’m me - I am going to say, it was the denial of reality that was the 2016 referendum, the genuflection of it ever since and the aggressive behaviour of the right wing press ever since that have cowed weak, spineless politicians Until them at shibboleth is defeated, we can replace governments and leaders as much as we want - won’t make a tack of difference we are in bizarro world since 2016 - only the electorate recognising that vocally will we see improvements without that, every government, party and leader will be in hock to fantasists (there are things govts can do regardless of Brexit. Of course there are. But the root - the root problem - will continue to infect)

Mad that on a thread about the telegraph (and are we saying they are a paragon of reporting? Are we?) it just happens to be the bbc and only the bbc copping the flak headnun - I’m not sure your point about despicable people “hanging themselves” holds up in a world where despicable people appear to be taking over in so many places for too long, these people have been given equal airtime to normal people, creating a false equivalence - the result being a lot of people seem to think “well if one person thinks smoking is bad for you and one person thinks it’s good for you, who am I to say who is right and wrong”

(Looks at title of thread)

“You are advocating that their failure to be impartial is justified because you disagree politically with the people they are inaccurate about. ” im arguing no such thing. I saw lowe’s comments misreported by several news sources and then in saw the corrections and apologies roll in. Correctly I think you will find everyone gets misreported. Pretty frequently. but whereas I think Badenoch is as mad as a box of frogs and a bad leader of Tories or starmer is not up to the job of leading the Labour party I think they both fit under the “norms” of political life and they tend to run with the punches a bit more Trump and Lowe are not just people I disagree with. They are fundamentally anti-democratic, racist pathetic men who should have no proximity to power - they also should not be misreported. But they do have thinner skin (something they share with say, Corbyn)

Fine dude - you do you. I dont think you have the slightest interest in the BBC (whereas clearly HeadNun dos) other than its elimination. If it made these mistakes against starmer/davey/greens whoever I doubt you would get as upset. It’s all very “bring a pen to Brexit referendum because they can rub out pencil votes” (“but strafe!! Dave hasn’t said any of these things on here and if you suggest he does elsewhere you have no proof!” This is true! And yet here we are ) I’ll ask again. Why do you think lowe said foreigner and domestic. Instead of just “criminals”?

Sorry if this is bullying, or name calling or whatever but anyone quoting Rupert Lowe is just never ever going to have a valid point several people misreported that line not just the bbc - seems to have been a mishearing and I’ve seen plenty of corrections So I don’t think it was a lie (it remains a curious distinction tho why say foreigners and domestic at all If you want to bring back the death penalty why mention this distinction?) Here’s a question. If Lowe or his party took power and introduced the death penalty, do you think proportionally more “domestics” or”foreign born” would receive the death penalty? Because I think I know the answer and so do you This bastion of truth. Rupert Lowe https://www.bbc.co.uk/search?d=NEWS_PS I wouldnt put him on any pedestal above the bbc

That example seems fair enough - but wouldn’t say it’s completely analogous to the Trump situation the STORY (your caps) is about the bbc edit precisely because of what happened that day and people’s ability to brush it under the carpet. I think the edit didn’t need to be done in that way to make the exact same point. So it’s wrong thing to do, but it isn’t actually incorrect in its point - and people should be reexamining the events and not the edit and I don’t think it’s political to say or do this. If your supporter example played out that way then fair enough - I just cannot agree that in this case the edit fundamentally changes what he said, meant or did - especially without events transpired It could definitely be made more explicit but given what actually happened… ? At least hopefully at this point we are being less aggy with each other and trying to make our points

I mean frankly we are a LONG way from the time I was called the Kofi Annan of the forum

But HN if you say this isn’t about Trump then we can never ever even approach dialogue the documentary was about Trump, the things he said and did and how those words were edited and acted on if you want to ignore absolutely everything else and just in a complete vacuum look at an editing decision - that’s on you I don’t think you are a proactive Trump supporter. But you make yourself one by proxy if you can’t look at this decision in the round. He literally does not care about these rules. Which is why he gets away with so much. If we were talking about him in the past tense then this would be easier - but he is very much an enemy of everything we hold dear, and the bbc isn’t - even allowing for this edit if I have previously explicitly or otherwise painted you as an actual Trump supporter I apologise and clarify that now. But on this actual issue I don’t think we will ever come close to agreeing Meanwhile - bbc enemies run their hands and trump carries on with his mission