barrymarshall

Jayd - the white stuff shop? I've walked past it but never been in. Doesn't look my style, really. I don't think of ED or LL as a place to buy clothes - I usually just to up the West End. The funny thing about the gentrification argument I hear in ED is that we have Barclays and HSBC, Somerfield, Budgens and Iceland, all big national chains and people don't complain about those, but a Cafe Nero or White Stuff or Foxtons do cuase outrage.

ooops!

there's a health food shop on LL?

Ted Max - thanks for the correction on Maggie - I knew that in the end she dislliked Dulwich becuase you had to drive through Brixton or Camberwell to get there. I realise too about the childless bit - but it would be interesting for Jayd to compare how gentrification works in different areas - compare and contrast? Also, I think people often conflate gentrification and a rise in living standards in general.

Jayd5 - I think there are two broadly separate (but still connected - bear with me) issues concerning gentrification. The first centres around consumerism, the second around issues such as jobs and housing. People complain about gentrification because it brings in the coffee chains, the Foxtons and all the other brands. When gentrification reaches a certain point, the early adopters of a place complain because it is no longer so "cool", ie too many people are now in on the secret. Bigger chains move in because the place now has a certain demographic profile and what was a hip or edgy place now looks like everywhere else. But all this is about lifestyle and patterns of consumption, and what people think about themselves. If you think you are distinct from most of the rest of the population, who drink in a starbucks, buy from gap, etc., etc., you won't be too happy when they start to move here. This is becuase there are different levels of people in the know and there are those who are slower to catch on to a "cool" place than others. The paradox is that the early adopters of cool can cause the problem in the first place. Take Hoxton. A demonstration of the ideology of "cool" played out par excellence. For a more in-depth exposition of this argument, read The Rebel Sell by Potter and Heath, link to an essay summarising their argument here: The second issue is more important. You will probably have come across the case of Williamsburg, Manhattan. A traditional working class neighbourhood that was over a decade ago starting to be populated with artists etc looking for cheap rents. Of course, it got a reputation for being cool and wealtheir people, stockbrokers, lawyers, etc., moved in and prices wnet up, pricing local people out of the market. Not only that, but the demographic of people moving in but commuting into the city centre meant that local businesses lost out on trade, folded and different businesses moved in. rents went up so only the more upscale businesses could afford to operate. Also, as the demographic changes so the provision of services changes. Working class inhabitants might not have access to jobs or schools if lots of young childless commuters descend on an area. This obviously happens a lot more slowly. Also, they may send their kids off to better parts of the city, meaning a welathy area has bad schooling (Islington?). I don't know what others think of this. I actually don't think ED is too bad as it was already a fairly wealthy area - remember, MAGGIE THATCHER moved round here (okay, so it wa the village) when she quit as PM. I doubt she'd have moved to Shoreditch, Behtnal Green or Brick Lane back then!

Roisin Murphy: actually the new record is okay - bit housey now and then, but a seventies/eighties icey electroness pervades. I hope she gets a bit more recognition this time. As I was reading yesterday, can it really be almost a decade since "Sing it Back"?

Just picked up a copy of the new Roisin Murphy album, Overpowered. I hope it's really good, loved her last album she did with Matthew Herbert. Not had chance to listen to this yet, tho. So tecnhically I shouldn't be posting this ... Doh, will get back to you soon.

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Sean - I was in Islington on Friday night and back home on LL on Saturday. While they are obviously not the same, there is a danger LL is heading that way. I think it is also only follwoing a pattern established almost every toher town/city centre across the country. Yeah, if you live in a "trendy" or desirable area like ED it is inevitable that the "wrong sort" will want to come along to. What happens is a place becomes noted for being cool or nice to go out. Fine when it starts but of course everyone wants to go to the cool places, and they stop being cool because they're too successful. On the wider socio-alcoholic issues, the best way to combat this is for people to police their own behaviour and that of others. I wish that we could step in and intervene without fearing for our own personal saftey though. And how do we create a culture where yobbish behaviour is unacceptable? Most people do though go out and don't cause anyone else any bother but themselves and their livers. I still think ED is the place I moved to over a year ago, and the reason I moved here still stands: you can go out and not see any bother at all. It is relatively safe (compared to neighbouring boroughs) but it is worrying to hear about violence like that on the other thread. Does anyone know if there has been a recent actual (ie recorded) rise in attacks like this, or crime in general?

just out of interest, Admin, just how did you know it originated from OS?

cheers Jah - last time I cehcked it wasn't available. My favourite track on Pick-a-Dub is the penultimate one: "I'm Alright" - Horace Andy's voice ...

You're welcome, Jah. Yeah, I have a a fair bit of the same stuff. My favourites also include the Congos album and the Dub Gone Crazy LP too. What I love about dub is that there's so much out there, so many tracks and albums all from this small islamd in such a short space of time, but a seemingly limitless stream of militant and spiritual music. I wonder - have you heard an album called "Flesh of my Skin" by Keith Hudson? I've been trying to get a copy (CD or vinyl) for ages, with no success. The vinyl will now be ultra-rare, but it was re-issued on CD several years back.

careful mamafeelgood, you know what the Tories are like with their, ahem, sexual peccadilloes. You wouldn't want to encourage them

hmmm ... he does indeed have something of the Blofeld about him ... but it's the weird thing he does with his jaw, have you noticed?

Yup - Blood and Fire were indeed backed by Mick Hucknall. It's weird, Mr Simply Red has great taste in music, which only makes it all the more weird why his own stuff was so ... pants. http://observer.guardian.co.uk/omm/story/0,,1304486,00.html

right - and Gordo saying nothing until after the poll showing the Tories level only further eroded any credibility he had. A stupendously bad call. In fact, the election farago reminds me of the contstant briefing against Blair while he was chancellor. To be sure, Blair's lot did the same too, but this only underlines the issue as being one of personality and or the perosnal power of those invovled, and not about real politics. Still, dunno about you, but to me there's not much in the election contest anyway - it's either more of the same, or more of the same. Depends on whether you prefer a Scottish brogue or plummy Etonian mouthing more or less the same words at you.

Jah - there's a great compilation out there called In Fine Style, which collects a load of the Original Rockers 12" stuff from the seventies. It's out on the Pressure Sounds label. You might already have some of these tracks already, but there is some of the greatest dub I've ever heard on this album (apart from the King Tubby Meets Rockers Uptown LP, of course!). By the way, did you hear that the Manchester-based Blood and Fire dub and roots re-issue label has closed down?

Citizen - the problem is that calling an election is a Prime Ministerial prerogative (within a five-year limit). If the date were forever fixed there would be none of this. Also, it is not just the press. Gordo's people were spreading the rumours of an early election deliberately to whip up election frenzy in the Meejah. And if there's one thing our media love, it is a knock-out contest (prefereably with premium rate phone calls!).

just finished with season three of teh new Battlestar Galactica. Possibly teh best TV show I have seen ever ... Cannot wait for teh new saeson, shjowing now in teh states ... Gonna go back to teh darkside of Murdoch and get Sky so i can watch it (yes, I am that sad!)

nice one Jah Lush - I was listening to some Augustus Pablo this mornign before I went to work. I was really luck as i once found a copy of teh original vinyl "East of teh River Nile" ... sublime

The idea was floated because over the summer Brown's camp thought he would win a thumping victory, demolish Cameron and not need to bother with another one for five more years. However, polling in the marginal constituencies showed that support for Brown/Labour was more uncertain - it was even before the Tories unveiled the inheritance tax proposals. Having said that, Labour are in a far stronger position that Major was in the run up to 1992. In fact, Labour consistently polled 50% or more since the mid-eighties, but it took until 1997 for them to win.

My (now ex-) girlfriend and I went to a few estate agents over a year ago when we were looking to move to ED. Haart were pretty poor and unenthusiastic. We said we'd only got a grand per month budget for rentals and we didn't get anything from them. Winkworth were even more dismissive. Definitely try Acorn - they were not only helpful and encouraging, they had loads of properties on their books, one of which I am still living in. Only treouble with them was thay we had to go all the way over to Ladywell on moving day to pick up the keys to the place, adding an extra two hours to our day - grrrr!