Rockets

That's a great article, not least because I am sure many of the usual suspects will be bombarding Southwark News with....it wasn't 1,000 people messages....;-) All we need now is for some media to challenge Cllr Rose on demonstrating her claims of "extraordinary impact in increasing active travel and reducing car use" to take this story to another level. Unfortunately for all the bluster the council's claims don't stand up well under scrutiny. I did think it was interesting that in the BBC Radio London interview Cllr Williams kept trying to talk about Southwark wide and the interviewer kept trying to get him to focus just on Dulwich. I suspect the council knows the Dulwich numbers don't add up.

There is a concerted effort to try and shame anyone who dares challenge the pro-LTN narrative at the moment and it has gone into overdrive following the protest. It seems attack is the only form of defensive some people have to counter rational and pragmatic analysis of the true reality of LTNs.

I think what matters right now is that there is a concerted effort by the pro-LTN supporters to try to discredit everything One Dulwich does - all of the usual suspects are posting to Twitter saying how awful the demonstration was, how it blocked the road (when it didn't), how there was graffiti (when many think that graffiti has been there for some time - certainly I had seen that daubed on one of the signs prior to Saturday), how there wasn't 1,000 people etc etc. It really goes to show just how effective One Dulwich and the other groups are - they have galvanised support against the LTNs and the pro-LTN lobby is trying to attack them at every opportunity (seemingly going out of their way to create falsehoods to enable them to attack those people protesting at the Junction). All that shows is that the anti-LTN lobby groups are being much more effective than the council, and its supporters, thought they would ever be. Power to the People and all that!!!! P.S. For my two-penneth worth I reckon there were 500+ people there on Saturday.

I heard that the 1,000 figure was determined after someone from One Dulwich found the secret formula the council uses to determine modal shift figures for their reviews!!!! ;-)

Latest OneDuwlich update....we made the BBC News.....! ;&) Our protest against the Dulwich road measures An estimated 1,000 people living in and around Dulwich ? young families, cyclists, older people and those with disabilities ? took part in our peaceful protest on Saturday 16 October. Thank you to everyone who came. You can see coverage on this BBC local news item here, and we will be putting up clips on social media and on our website shortly. Speakers included clean air campaigner David Smith (also known as @LittleNinjaUK on Twitter) and representatives from One Dulwich and the Dulwich Alliance. Cllr Rose?s decision Just before our protest, we discovered that the call-in by Lib Dem councillors on Southwark?s Overview and Scrutiny Committee ? that is, their request for Cllr Rose?s decision to be reviewed ? had been turned down (see this report in the South London Press). We have asked the Council to explain why, and are waiting for their response. As far as we know, this means that there will now be a 21-day statutory consultation period before the traffic orders can be made permanent. We have written to Southwark asking them for information about this ? so far, we can find nothing on their website. What next? 1. We will be holding further protests in other parts of Dulwich over the next few weeks, which we hope will be good news for those of you who weren?t able to come on Saturday because of half term. Details to follow. Let?s double the size of Saturday?s protest and get even more media coverage. 2. We will also be asking you to respond to Southwark?s 21-day statutory consultation with very specific objections to all the measures over the whole Dulwich area. Again, more to follow once Southwark have provided details of the timeline. 3. Please keep emailing your local councillors, decision-maker [email protected] and your local MP, reminding them (i) that two-thirds of those living and working in all three Dulwich LTNs who responded to Southwark?s consultation opted for all the measures to be removed, and (ii) that the council?s current refusal to listen may be reflected in the results of the local elections in May 2022. 4. If, at the end of the 21-day consultation period, Southwark continues to ignore local demands for a fair scheme that fulfils all its obligations as a local authority, we will ask our legal team to advise on the best course of action. Thanks to your generous donations to our fighting fund, our legal team is reviewing all the paperwork and stands ready to move quickly. Best wishes, The One Dulwich

I think LAS and the other emergency services have been telling Southwark the DV measures need to be made permeable since they went in. Who knows how long it will be before they finally concede. On that note why was Cllr Williams saying they are consulting with residents on the proposed changes on his interview on the BBC - can we expect another consultation?

What's funny is that yesterday there was a taped off, marshalled lane in front of Au Ciel as the police told the organisers that that's where they needed to keep the road clear. The previous week a full music ensemble set-up blocking the same area for the Music in the Square event and not a single person tried to cycle through and take issue with it. Funny that.....

Lots of bah humbug on display today. What they fail to realize is there was a dedicated, marshalled lane to the left of the junction through the crowd. But hey, never let the truth get in the way of a good story!

I see Clean Air Dulwich are claiming it was dangerous for cyclists as it was all blocked. Well it wasn't as there was a dedicated cycle route through the crowd which was taped off and being marshalled as directed by the police. They just chose not to use it. You have to wonder why some are so hell-bent on de-0ositioning a group protesting. Maybe the issue was there were so many people protesting that groups like Clean Air Dulwich take offence to.

Spartacus Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I'm curious > > Were any councillors or council officers there to > see the level of protest going on ? I very much doubt it. Someone did shout out where is Helen Hayes and someone close to me suggested she disappeared at the same time the ATM did that Margy claimed to have saved and whether that was a coincidence! ;-)

march46 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Not sure where you are getting your facts from > Metallic. If you look at the council?s > consultation report it shows 67% of Calton Ave > respondents and 53% of Court Lane respondents wish > to RETAIN it as it is / RETAIN the measure but > modify/enhance with other features. > > > Metallic Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > Except it seems very few people in Calton Ave > and > > Court Lane, in the bigger number of them, > wanted > > this closed off area. I know I didn't, and > people > > in Woodwarde, Court Lane, the Village certainly > > didn't. Your comment fans the division. You > > don't know who and how many you are actually > > slagging off. March - the council are desperately hanging on to these measures on the basis of the results from Calton and Court Lane as they are the only streets that have not resoundingly voted against any measures. But this isn't just about Calton or Court Lane it is about the impact on the whole area (but saying that the fact there is so much opposition on Calton and Court Lane is a strong sign that these measures are not as popular as you, or the council would like). You are amalgamating three categories to get your percentage (do you perhaps work for the council?). Bottom line is today hundreds of Dulwich residents gathered to protest against unjust measures that the majority of Dulwich residents have told the council they do not want. You can pontificate all you like but I was so heartened to see a community uniting against a council that continues to treat the views of constituents with utter contempt. The small vocal minority is anything but and the tide is finally beginning to turn.

Well done Dulwich - a superb turnout and well done to all the excellent speakers who attended.

Good news! Glad you found it!

Metallic Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I am writing about the LTN row so this is the > right page. > > Isn't it horrid for the viewpoints to be so split? > And here we are listening to news of another MP > murdered. Passion runs so high, and some of the > nastier comments I have read on here about the > different angles of this very local row, seem to > show a bit of simmering hatred for people who > don't agree with you and who you think you can > badmouth as you are anonymous. > > So let's all be more respectful to each other, > please. And that includes the Councillors who pay > no heed to what their constituents say to them, or > listen to that other viewpoint. It's probably the only thing all the contributors on here will agree with: it's divided a community.

This is fascinating: Kieron Williams talking on BBC Radio London - he gets asked about LTNs at 6.31.... So he admits there is increased congestion on some roads. A lot of bluster and puff though..... He says they are consulting on the proposed changes and residents will be responding over the next few weeks - does anyone know what that is - he is implying there is a consultation of the suggested changes from the consultation? https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p09ynqjt

It's funny isn't it - how many sensible ideas that have been put forward by residents since the LTNs went in? Makes you wonder why the council/TFL didn't think of some of them instead of putting all their time, money and energy into a policy so fundamentally flawed as the LTNs. What I find incredible is that since the LTNs have gone in the council has done nothing to initiate any programmes to further facilitate active travel - the roll-out of cycle hangars has been shameful and other boroughs have created segregated cycle lanes. Southwark seems to have been a bit of a one-trick pony; it's LTNs or nothing. They have wasted 18 months on a glorified vanity project.

march46 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > One Dulwich clearly were involved in putting the > signs up. Their email account facilitated it. > > https://i.imgur.com/K1mWt6D.jpg > > > Rockets Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > March - let us be clear One Dulwich have not > put > > any signs up. People who believe the council > needs > > to "Stop the Road Closures" put the signs up. I really don't know what point you are trying to make - you seem to be just trying to portray One Dulwich in a negative light. One Dulwich didn't go around putting the signs up randomly in people's gardens - people requested them - and a lot of people requested them. And you say people have been banned from the forum you have no proof that the person who set-up the onedulwich account on the forum had anything to do with the onedulwich organisation - LTNBooHoo, Manatee etc were also banned around the same time - so again, what point are you trying to make exactly? If truth be told I think what you're really angry about is the fact that OneDulwich has been doing a great job educating the majority of Dulwich residents as to what has been happening and how poorly the council has been treating residents who live here.

March - let us be clear One Dulwich have not put any signs up. People who believe the council needs to "Stop the Road Closures" put the signs up. The position of One Dulwich and, seemingly, the majority of people in Dulwich is that the road closures are a "solution" that is making the problem worse and benefitting a few but negatively impacting the majority. Let me ask you a question: do you think the road closures in DV are a fair and equitable solution to the problem? Are you happy that they have totally failed to deliver on the stated aims the council sold you on?

Errr March - Stop the Road Closures has applied since day one. One Dulwich, and the emergency services for that matter, have, since day 1 been saying that closing roads is not the solution and create more problems than they alleviate. Timed closures are not closed roads - there is a big difference. Closed roads are roads where no traffic can pass through at any time. I am afraid you keep labouring a point where none exists as nowhere on the council's review documentation could you select "timed closures" as an option.

Unfortunately, the nudge element of the LTN strategy is to try to create just this scenario where people say, quite rightly, why should I have to live with the displacement whilst others have less traffic and ask their councillors for support and the best the councillors can muster is "do you want one?". It happened on the Dulwich Hill ward call after the LTNs went in. All the councillors knew what was going to happen when the OHS measures were suggested and didn't put up any sort of fight. It was, after all, why Cllr McAsh was, pre-Covid, going door to door on Melbourne Grove and surrounding streets as part of OHS and was telling people - DV/Court Lane will get closed and this will increase the traffic on your streets - do you want an LTN? A lot of us were hoping that at least one of the councillors would have stood-up and pushed back against the DV closures as it was clear what the fallout was going to be on their constituents.

One Dulwich update on the protest on Saturday: Saturday 16 October at 12 noon in Dulwich Village This Saturday 16 October, at 12 noon, we will be joining together at the central junction of Dulwich Village/Court Lane/Calton Avenue to protest against the LTNs in Dulwich Village, East Dulwich and Champion Hill. More information here. The police have been notified and will be in attendance, and we are putting in place all their requests to ensure a safe and peaceful protest. Now is the time for the majority ? the two-thirds of us living and working in the Dulwich area who responded to the consultation by rejecting the current scheme ? to come together and demand that Southwark Council scrap their flawed, unfair and divisive plans and start again. Southwark must listen to what local people are saying. Even with the recent tweaks, this is a bad scheme that displaces traffic on to residential roads with schools and health centres, discriminates against the vulnerable, and damages local businesses. Dulwich deserves better. Come and protest for the benefit of the whole community. See you on Saturday ? and thank you, as always, for your support.

But CPR, who then has to live with the traffic. Therein lies the biggest problems with LTNs - they don't solve the problem, they move it somewhere else.

So it basically renders consultations as a pointless waste of tax-payers money, a tick-box approach to say - we fulfilled our obligations by pretending to be interested in what people think! Meanwhile, I cannot help but notice that there is a concerted effort by the pro-LTN lobby to try to deposition One Dulwich on the basis of the narrative we have seen on here "what do they want, how can they ask for timed closures yet still push for the removal of the hard closures, do they agree with Townley etc etc etc". Anytime that happens you know they must be cutting through. Well done One Dulwich, keep up the excellent work. Roll on Saturday at noon at The Junction!

Malumbu - so what's the point of the consultation? A consultation cannot be something you only do to try to get validation of what you want to do - which is how Southwark council seem to use them now. According to the Local Government Association a consultation is: Consultation is technically any activity that gives local people a voice and an opportunity to influence important decisions. It involves listening to and learning from local people before decisions are made or priorities are set. Can you explain to me how that definition applies to how Southwark have acted on the LTN consultation? Southwark are not giving local people a voice - they are, in fact, ignoring the majority of local people. Whichever side of the debate you are on what Southwark is doing now sets a very dangerous precedent.

Cllr McAsh - in the same way that you believe that the Rye Lane closure is impacting the residents of Goose Green the LTN closures in your ward and the Dulwich Village ward are impacting all residents in the Dulwich area. I know you are trying to play the "please talk to other councillors card" to avoid giving a response but surely you can give us your opinion. You just gave us your opinion on a matter creating issues for your constituents within your ward but not directly linked to your ward so maybe you could do the same for the LTN issue. You were, after all, a key advocate for the closures and were lobbying for them but you cannot be happy that 68% of constituents (many of them your constituents) have said they want the closures removed and yet the council is ignoring them. I think many of the posters here are interested in hearing a response from you, especially what you perceive the benefits to be as they are not clear to many of us. Of course, if the party line is not to comment on this then that's fair enough but there are a lot of people who you, and your colleagues, claim to represent who are feeling very let down right now. If you steadfastly refuse to engage with someone who lives outside your ward then maybe one of your constituents who posts here can ask the same questions in an attempt to garner a response.