DJ thanks for the interesting post. I think that many people are not exposed to, experienced or used to talking to offenders or ex offenders and the fear that is attached to 'what they might do' gets in the way of realising that they are people who have taken a wrong turn. I base this on reactions from colleagues who ask if I am afraid when I go into the two prisons I work in. As you say many of them respond to respect, genuine interest and an opportunity to be constructive. What kind of society do we want? If we answer that question we may get nearer the solutions. I think it is reasonable to expect that we want a peaceful,productive society with people using the talents they were born with or can develop - idealistic I know but if we have a vision of something as near to that as possible it will go halfway to helping. I am interested to know what SNT means. By the way for those who make sweeping statements about white and middle class people, I am white and middle class, I spend most of my working week contributing to society not only with a sense of responsibility but with passion and my appeal is for more listening and open mindedness. Thank you.